2007 General Convention Editorial

Hermanos,

Would you so kind in welcoming Brother Josh Bayne to the podium as he provides an analysis of the 2007 General Convention at the Gaylord Resort in Fort Worth Texas. Brother Bayne was asked by us to provide some insight as to what he witnessed at the convention. In my discussion with him, I realized that he may be the most unbiased person to provide this type of on the scene reporting.
I really hate to have to say, please be respectful as he is a guest blogger on this site, but I feel I must. Let's show him what warm hearts we in the AAFCJ have. I always find in interesting how we are percieved outside looking in.

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I must admit, I was a little keener to the unusual atmosphere of this years General Convention of the Apostolic Assembly of the Faith in Jesus Christ. I had already done some reading and research concerning the Election Scandal of the General Convention of the previous year. During my research I found myself with a pretty objective attitude due to my lack of relationship with the Apostolic Assembly or its General Board. But as I walked through the doors of the Gaylord Texan, in Grapevine Texas, I was immediately confronted with an amazing sense of tension.

There were 2 types of people I met in Grapevine. The first was the person who was there for information and justice. This person really didn’t seem too interested in the convention itself, but rather in the business meetings and the way the assembly of believers would react to the accusations towards the General Board.

The second type of person was the vacationer. Although they were greatly blessed by the messages by people like Bro. Romo, and Bro. Aguilar, they were more there for a time away at a great resort. As a matter of fact, a good friend of mine who pastors in California said they only went to one service, as they really wanted to spend time with their family in such a “beautiful resort”.

There were plenty of rumors flying around the convention from the start. Rumors about Bishop Sanchez having a nervous breakdown. Rumors about a host of pastors who would be announcing their departure from the Apostolic Assembly and starting a new organization, or going independent. Rumors that the lawyers for the plaintiffs in the case brought against the Assembly and its General Board were present and accounted for. Although some of these rumors turned out to be true, the fact that rumors of this size had been started in the first place struck me as unusual.

I feel like everything I had witnessed so far I did so with a large amount of objectivity. I had refrained from casting stones at people. I had been very respectful of the call of God on the men’s lives who were leading this organization. But then something happened, I witnessed the offering portions of the convention, both of the Youth and General services. There wasn’t a single service I attended in which a large amount of time and effort was taken receiving the offering. Each time an offering was taken it was done so in a way that the person giving the offering was glorified for the amount they gave not the sacrifice in which was made by their giving. It truly was a sad situation. I know I may catch some heat for making this next statement, but here goes…

When will people learn that the way they treat their finances has just as much to do with them going to heaven as does being baptized in the name of Jesus? When will people learn that Jesus cares just as much about your check book as he does your witnessing abilities? The Bible has commanded us to be good stewards with the blessings, both monetary and non-monetary, he has given us. This commandment also is for the elders of the church. As a matter of fact, the offerings aren’t for the Pastors, preachers, and teachers. The tithe is, but not the offering. The offering is to carry on the work of the Lord, while the tithe is there to support the ministry and their families. I am completely confounded as to why so many Oneness Apostolic’s (UPC, PAW, IAFCJ, ALJC, AAFJC, etc.) can’t get this through their heads.

Consider this a prophetic word: When the Apostolic Church of the 21st Century turns from their money loving ways there will be an amazing Revival in the church, as well as an Abundant Harvest of new souls.

This is ultimately what I walked away with: Yes, there is probably some truth to the accusations of the plaintiffs, and yes there is probably some truth to the accusations by the defendants. But what is most true about the entire scandal is, this has everything to do with money and nothing to do with the souls of believers and the lost. Many members of the Apostolic Assembly have lost sight of what is really important.

Let me tell you what is NOT important (Here comes the heat again). Being Apostolic is not important. Walking around with your nose tilted in the air because you have taken on the title of Apostolic is so far from important it almost laughable. Jesus didn’t call you to be Apostolic.
Now for what IS important: Being a Christian. Being a Soul Winner. Being sure of your salvation. Being a Prayer Warrior. Being Sold out. Being ready for the rapture. Guess what hermanos y hermanas; None of this has anything to do with being Apostolic.

I dare you to call a Baptist church in your local town and ask them what they think of Apostolic’s. Once they get beyond the doctrinal differences they will start talking about “self-righteous attitudes”. They will tell you “they seem to be caught in the 19th Century”. “They seem to use coercion in getting new believers to come to Christ”. “Heavy Handed”, “Legalistic”, “They have Dictators as Pastors”, “They look like they fell out of the ugly tree and hit every branch on the way down.”. I have personally heard these comments from denominational pastors, preachers, and members (Even the last one).

Apostolics, its time to let go of “our” title, and put on the title that Christ gave us; “Beloved”.
As for the General Board and this years General Convention and Youth Conference, it was alright. Nothing to special. Lots of talk and no action. Lots of hype, but no follow through. How long will it be that a man or woman of God will finally say enough is enough and do something? The Apostolic church of yesterday is dying, the Apostolic church of Today is ill, and the Apostolic church of tomorrow won’t know what hit them.

Bro. Josh Bayne is a licensed minister and Professional Audio Engineer. He and his wife (Rebecca Brito-Bayne) have a 4 month old son named J. Michael. Josh and Rebecca are founders of MyMinistryFinder.com which links Apostolic and other denominational ministers to churches in need of their help. Consider it a monster.com for churches.

Signed, Sealed, Delivered

The time has arrived! I agree with the person that said why boycott this convention as it may turn out to be one of the most interesting in our lifetime. Take pictures, video and audio files of interesting items you may encounter.

However, my gut feeling tells me that this legal action is of no benefit to the Apostolic Assembly as a whole.

1. This action could drag on until 2010 when the next election is to take place thus nullifying this filing.

2. If the plaintiffs win, it really hasn't changed the way the AA does business. There still is no oversight to the General Board, the same group of men that have been running the show for the past twenty years are trying to position themselves for the next twenty years, save Bro. Torres.
Which group of good 'ol boys do we want in office?, which really doesn't matter due the fact that I would venture to suggest that every election has been rigged since the inception of the Apostolic Assembly.

3. If the existing General Board wins, it is a legal mandate that they can continue business as usual. This without a doubt will lead organizational split because of (a.) those on the plaintiffs side will be excommunicated, maybe not formally but ministerially and socially and (b.) pride.

It is a very interesting situation we are experiencing. We need an oversight committee with truly independent, unbiased representatives that have no social, financial ties or political ladders to climb. All people with any previous position should not be on this committee. The General Board is responsible to this committee. It could be respected leaders from other business', educational and religious institutions and not AA members. Some may ask why do we need this? And I would be quick to remind you of the situation we are in. We need this more than ever! I don't care who is on the General Board, they need to be accountable for their actions to some one. And they are not choosing to be accountable to the constituency. That goes for the people on both sides of the lawsuit.

Thanks to those keeping track of the dates of the dates for the lawsuit. Keep us updated.

One more note, I thought it was interesting the plaintiffs noted in their lawsuit that they do not know if they have been financially impacted. It was left as a question mark. By the way, are the plaintiffs going to release who, if any one, has contributed to the their legal "defense" fund (by the way they are not on the defense which why I think their term is humorous, it should be something like: 2006 General Elections Fairness Legal Fund or Apostolic Assembly Legal Fund to Ensure Fair Elections) and how those funds have used.

I am also going to stop the comments under the AAFCJ Election Discussion Update Post. The election discussion can continue under this post.


Felicidades,

Apostolic Voice
Blogmaster

p.s.

I updated the Shout Out city list, we are up to 326 cities.

New Rules ****Update 11/8/2007****

Over the past couple of days we've been working on a solution that would allow greater adminstrative control in controlling comments on this blog. We feel quite a bit of the comments are childish and belong on someone else's blog. The purpose of us being here is to discuss the current state of the AAFCJ and its continued growth. With that being said, in 48 hours (11/10/2008) we are going to require those that wish to voice their opinion and add pertinant discussion in this matter become registered users to this blog. We feel this will do a couple of things.

1. Allow us to control the frivolous comments in this site by removing those users that continue to waste bandwidth by commenting on their affection for the opposite sex and have no relevance to this discussion.

2. Create an identity (although that identity can still remain anonymous if you so desire) which will hold that identity responsible for its comments. For example, Mike A, will be forever Mike A because he has registered his identity and no one will be able to attribute a comment to him unless it really is him as with other registered users. To register please create an email account using GMail at www.gmail.com or your prefered mail provider.

We are doing this because your voice really matters and we want it to ensure its influence is not diminished.

Please not that we have been contacted by leaders on both sides of this issue and both sides have positively reacted to the voicing of your opinions. (Don't ask who they are because we won't disclose that information.)

The rules below still apply.

Apostolic Voice
11/08/2007

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Due to the amount of comments traffic and various other activities here, we are asking all participants to help us with the following:

Please post your comments in the appropriate sections.

* Bankrupt - Use this section if you wish to discuss accountability issues with the assembly leaders, ie., scams, scandals, swindles and various other questionable activities.

*AAFCJ Election Discussion Update - Keep this section clear for election related issues, not other scams scandals and so on. Remember Election related issues only.

*Shout Outs - Use this section for communicating activities, sending hello's or you affinity for each other, such as Sis. Nohemi Gonzales and/or Sergio Villanueva for example. Feel free to post your myspace pages in this section.

Thank you for your participation and helping with these guidelines. If you see some comments in the wrong section, politely remind them to continue the conversation in the appropriate section of your blog. This help with a smooth continuity of discussion and avoid clutter.

Thus Saith the Blogmaster!

Bankrupt

The subtitle might as well read "The Intellectual and Moral Bankruptcy of the Apostolic Assembly"

Who knew that a blog such as this would expose supposed wrong doing by so many men and women, young and old on both sides or on no side of the current AA situation.

In our age of instantaneous information available to all, accountability will be demanded. The old, smelly, stale carpet in our house has been removed and replaced with transparent glass thereby removing the opportunity for hidden agendas, intentions and actions to swept under the rug. On this new surface we will be able to see all the fingerprints, smears, smudges, mud and dirt. That is a good thing because they kinds of items can be easily cleaned, addressed as soon as they appear.

It almost hurts to read all the things hurled out about brothers I've held in high regard. It seems that as soon as a name comes it is like they are the object of a pie throwing contest in a county fair, including the dead including the recently deceased.

At the most very basic level the fault of the AA has that we have been taught not to question authority in any manner. The AA body has been taught to almost deify the man behind the pulpit or sitting in the big chair on the platform. We've been taught to roll out the red carpet, kiss their ring finger and believe that this person holds absolute authority. The ignorance of our forefathers treated leaders as though they where the high priests. As far as I know there is only one high priest.

As the newer generation moves into their own, we must realize they've been taught through higher learning institutions how to think critically: Question authority.

"Critical thinking is the intellectually disciplined process of actively and skillfully conceptualizing, applying, analyzing, synthesizing, and/or evaluating information gathered from, or generated by, observation, experience, reflection, reasoning, or communication, as a guide to belief and action". http://www.criticalthinking.org/aboutCT/definingCT.shtml

Unfortunately, our under-educated pastors and ministers are still of the mentality that we must believe and act according to what the man behind the pulpits dictates. Why? Because if he is behind the pulpit it must be the truth. There really is no logic in this type of thinking, even though this is the mentality that rules the ignorant masses. Fortunately hermanos, we are no longer part of that ignorant mass.

And our leaders played us because of our ignorance, we've been lied to, cheated, talked about mis-treated (anyone recognize this song). We've had dogma shoved down our throats with no biblical validity but "if you don't do what the pastor says, you are disobedient and rebellious".

Pastors/ministers/bishops/leaders, do me favor and stop preaching about the way I look on the outside. You are filled with sin, filth and deceit on the inside. Don't worry about sisters wearing pants, they are not going to hell because of it. There is absolutely no biblical validity to this! God does not love a pant wearer any less then a non-pant wearer. Don't preach to me about wearing jewelry, there to is no biblical validity to this either. I can use the same argument about watches and broaches, it is just stupid! The veil...let's not even go there.

We are saved by God's Grace not by what you think I should look like. It's funny how you think you can make God love someone more because of the way YOU want them to look.

In reality what you are doing is exactly what you've been doing - living a double standard and causing those in your congregations to live with double standards.

I teach my children to behave the same way when they are with me and when they are not with me. I teach them not to hide from me, I teach them that, I, as there father am not perfect and will make mistakes. And when I do make mistakes I will need their help and support. I teach them that they will make mistakes and they do not need to hide those mistakes from me because I will be there for them and not for the purpose of knocking them down. I teach my children that you are going to make mistakes, be selfish in your decision making and guidance (I do this because of your past history of looking out for your best interest and not mine) and not accurately apply God's word. I teach them it is their responsibility to take what you spoken and verify its validity with God's word - ...study to show thyself approved.

When you get behind the pulpit this coming Sunday, please remember, I am probably more educated than you, I probably make more money than you. I've spent countless hours studying God's word, studying for my degrees and analyzing financial and legal documents for real world business decisions. In my career I am compensated by helping other individuals and corporations make short and long term business projections. The bottom line is, I can see a grift coming from a mile away. (If you notice sometimes I wear my boots on Sunday.)

Spare me the dogma, God saved us by his grace, fortunately not your ignorance. It is because of your past decisions we have come to an intellectual and moral bankruptcy in our beloved organization.

We must reorganize and refocus our efforts in teaching God's grace, not Apostolic Assembly dogma.

Dios les pague

ApostolicVoice
Blogmaster

AAFCJ Election Discussion Update

The comment section for the original Election Irregularities blog has reached an overwhelming amount of of opinions (1,015+). As we approach the coming General Convention in November, it is important that this medium for the discussions regarding the Elections and Lawsuit continue, therefore tonight at 12am we will be stopping the comments from the original blog and will ask that you continue the discussion under this current blog.


Those comments will not be deleted but saved for all to review and add their opinion in this updated section. (They can be viewed here: http://apostolicnews.blogspot.com/2007/09/apostolic-assembly-2006-election.html)


We would also like to add that you may feel free to send in pictures, videos and comments of your local, district and national services. They will be posted here. You can email them to apostolicvoice@gmail.com

Your voice is being heard. Now, keep your eyes and ears open.

Dios Les Bendiga,
Apostolic Voice
Blogmaster

ps.
I don't know about you all but I am in serious prayer for the Arizona Diamondbacks. Is it wrong to fast tomorrow for their victory over the Colorado Rockies?

SHOUT OUT!*****UPDATE 11/18/07*****

**UPDATE 11/18/07**

The Blogmaster would like to send a SHOUT OUT! to all those representing the following cities(visitors to this site), in order of most active:

West Hollywood
Montclair
Midland
Tempe
Laguna Hills
Los Angeles
Chicago
Dallas
Loma Linda
Maywood
Santa Fe Springs
Glendale
San Lorenzo
West Covina
Fresno
Austin
New York
Mcallen
Spokane
San Diego
Chino
Odessa
Rowland Heights
Monterey Park
Selah
Houston
Pompano Beach
Ontario
Irving
National City
Carrollton
La Jolla
Harlingen
Montebello
Victorville
Alameda
Pomona
Pittsburgh
Sunnyvale
San Leandro
Modesto
March Afb
East Meadow
Corona
Albuquerque
Huntington Park
Hurst
Bluffton
Humble
(not set)
Empire
San Jose
Abilene
Phoenix
Tualatin
Santa Maria
Alviso
Belmont
Silver Spring
East Irvine
Tolleson
Norcross
Pasadena
Carmichael
Seattle
Laurel
Wildomar
Farmersville
Portland
Gilbert
Dyess Afb
Las Vegas
La Habra
Stafford
Grand Terrace
Tijuana
Cerritos
La Puente
Addison
Duluth
Garden Grove
San Juan
Richardson
Oakland
Rancho Cucamonga
San Marcos
Ogden
Sanger
Oxnard
Lemon Grove
Placentia
Tracy
Upland
Santo Domingo
Hesperia
Hughson
Lakewood
Walnut
Thousand Oaks
Phelan
Alhambra
Miami
Riverside
Tucson
North Miami Beach
Denver
San Ramon
Whittier
Cathedral City
Milpitas
Indio
Torrance
Fontana
Perris
La Mirada
Norman
Sun City
Jamestown
Tucker
Glendale
La Palma
Beverly Hills
Haltom City
Indian Wells
Santa Clara
Dublin
Alamo
Yuma
El Paso
Bell Gardens
Takoma Park
Boston
Encinitas
Bloomington
Santa Ana
Buena Park
Scottdale
San Francisco
Ceres
Herndon
Pico Rivera
Sacramento
Windsor
Artesia
Kaysville
Gardendale
Bellevue
Rialto
Englewood
Manteca
Fullerton
La Paz
Hacienda Heights
Downey
Bellflower
South El Monte
Opa Locka
Vista
Kerman
San Jacinto
Brea
Mountain View
Anaheim
South Orange
Foothill Ranch
Diamond Bar
Orange
Rancho Santa Fe
High Point
Kingston
River Forest
Pleasant Garden
New Braunfels
Valley Village
Pensacola
Pharr
Bakersfield
Los Alamitos
Panorama City
Columbia
Hilton Head Island
Milwaukee
Villa Park
Hayward
Merced
Santa Barbara
Inglewood
Newbury Park
Weslaco
Davenport
South Pasadena
Union City
Fremont
San Bernardino
Menifee
Catonsville
Oklahoma City
Colton
Lake Elsinore
Hialeah
Covina
Temecula
Baldwin Park
El Centro
Moreno Valley
Elmwood Park
North Hollywood
Mesa
Paradise Valley
Meridian
Bloomington
Canyon Country
Nogales
Carson
Palm Desert
San Antonio
El Mirage
Tahoka
Davenport
Culver City
Lathrop
St Louis
Boise
Beaumont
Nashville
Tampa
Lubbock
Vestal
Eugene
Sioux Falls
Atlanta
Honolulu
Devon
Marina
Midway City
Morrisville
Salida
Rancho Mirage
Nipomo
Roswell
Oak Park
Bensenville
Palatka
Tacoma
Mount Laurel
Racine
Monterrey
Newark
Long Beach
Irvine
Ripon
Lynwood
Wood Dale
Studio City
Cypress
Brisbane
Compton
San Luis Rey
Mission
Loomis
Gardena
Lilburn
Ashburn
Guadalajara
Barcelona
Poway
Fishers
Linden
San Marcos
Hawthorne
Westlake
Norwalk
Mentone
Commerce
Lafayette
Tustin
La Mesa
Ensenada
Hill Afb
Mcclellan
Bell
Irvington
Baltimore
Norco
Riverbank
Astoria
Redford
Arvada
Springfield
Temple City
Canyon
Hawthorne
Hillside
Rex
Yakima
Bedford
Bronx
Lawndale
Rosemead
Woods Cross
Monrovia
Eden Prairie
Laredo
Orlando
City of Industry
Bremerton
Millington
Ottawa
North Richland Hills
Stockbridge
Mira Loma
Garland
Del Mar
Grand Prairie
Pleasanton
Vancouver
Tok
Sunol
Costa Mesa
Kirtland Afb
Marina Del Rey
El Monte
Coppell
Corrales
Shreveport
Harwood Heights

There are 326 cities represented here.

Felicidades,

Apostolic Voice

Blogmaster

Can you hear me now? Good!

No matter what side of the election story you as the Apostolic Assembly body are on, it seems that we agree on one thing. The CID is bad. One person wrote:

So why waist so much money having an electoral convention add to that the time waist by 600+ MoG(7 AM to 6 PM) , if the Qualifying commission allowed the disqualification of the majority vote nominee.

This speaks clearly of the type of pastoral leadership we have in the Assembly. For not 1 on of the 600+ spoke out against the CID in the years prior to the election including all the Bishops!
I know some Pastor's look for yes men in their churches, those that will follow blindly, but these Pastor's should be held accountable as well for allowing this to happen. Pastor's need not be yes men and follow blindly in order that they can move to the next level.

This smacks 4 of the 9 problems that plagues our organization that a previous brother or sister articulated so well:

1. Authoritarian Hierarchy.

2. Lack of Accountability.

6.Local congregations not a true priority.

9. Organization more important than Jesus or people.

Demand that the CID is removed!

I'll wear this button at he convention.

1. It is not going against and does not disrespect any Man of God.

2. It tells the Pastoral, Episcopal, and GB bodies that will not tolerate political tactics in the affairs of our desire to seeking God's plan in our organization!

3. It holds all that voted for it accountable to the entire Assembly constituency.

4. And It does so in a way that is respectful and in silent.

We could design different respectful signs referencing the CID and have them placed strategically throughout the conference. This will be more effective than any lawsuit.

Things That Make You Go Hmmmm.....?

We at Apostolic News do not take sides in this present 2006 General Election Irregularities issue, however there are some tough questions that need to be asked. After all "We Report, You Decide".

Question #1:
What is going to happen "if" the pro-lawsuit group proceeds with their lawsuit and "if" it is thrown out, rejected or those involved found not guilty?

Question #2:
Are they going to publicly apologize for dragging this entire Assembly through the gutter and opening the closets of what where some of the most admired men in our organization?

Question #3:
How will they be held accountable?

Question #4:
Will they be labeled as division makers as the bible dictates?

Question #5:
Should the Assembly seek punitive damages and reimbursement of legal fees?

Question #6:
Will we the people allow them to continue ministering in our churches?

Question #7:
What will happen if they decide to settle out of court (as we think those negotiations are going on now)?

Question #8:
Where they only doing this for political positioning?

Question #9:
If they do settle out of court how does the Assembly heal the strife and chaos caused by all this?

Question #10:
"If" the pro-lawsuit group walks away or the legal verdict is not in their favor, we should demand accountability on their behalf?

Questions #11:
Will they try to brush this entire debacle under the rug?

Questions #12:
Why does the man in this picture have a Ritz cracker pinned to the lapel of his jacket?

A Historical Perspective

Tonight while I was cleaning up the shenanigans of a few kids spraying graffiti on our Apostolic News blog, I came across this post that was emailed in. I do not take credit for it, I cannot verify its authenticity. I did not even edit for grammer. Please read "as is", stuffed in my inbox. A few old timers should chime in here and give us their perspective.

Author Anonymous

A LITTLE BIT OF HISTORY SO YOU CAN UNDERSTAND WHY THIS BOARD OF THE APOSTOLIC ASSEMBLY IN THE FAITH IN CHIRST JESUS CAME TO THIS CRISES.

IN THE YEAR OF 1925 the first convention was held in San Bernardino,California
General Pastor Francisco F. Llorente
Ancianos Pastor Antonio Castaneda Nava, Jose Martinez L. Martinez.
Secretario Convencionista, Bernardo Hernandez.

This continued for several years, cannot go into deep detail. See
"Historia de la Asamblea de la Fe en Cristo Jesus 1916-1966.

See and read whose names is all over the pages, who gets all the credit. How President Francisco Llorente was found be by the Elder
Antonio Nava to be "not really doing his job.(Brother Llorente)
Nava very shudrely "left to Mexico" to visit relatives and how a "Commission" conspired by Nava to "ask" Brother Llorente to "resign" because according to Nava Brother Llorente was not "evangelizing sufficently.

Brother Llorente, an anointed man of God, bi-lingual and very humble and a prayer warrior. Brother LLorente was a great leader and was at one time known to have worn "women shoes", because of the Great Depression crises.There was extreme poverty and lack of everything for everyone in the U.S.A.

Brother LLorente was notified by a messenger before hand that this "commission" was going to present to Brother Llorente the faults that this "commission"was going to present to Brother Llorente, as he was found guilty of non compliance to continuing evangelizing. This was cruel because he was not even tried.

Knowing when the "committee" was coming to meet with Brother Llorente. Brother LLorent became very ill and had a cardiac arrest the "commission" or "committee" got there. The "committee" got there in time for the funeral services.

THEN BROTHER NAVA RETURNED> NEVER being presentin FUTURE WHEN CRISES AROSE. BUT RETURNED IN TO TIME TO "ASSUME" THE PRESIDENCY FOR 30 long years. Not allowing elections. It was when pressure was put by Brother Arturo Hermosillo and Brother Epifanio Cota Senior, and Brother Paublo Garcia Chavez, from Arizona, New Mexico that the elections were forced to be held.....
Brother Nava could not run again because he would not become a USA citizen because there was NO double citizenship then and he had alot of properties in Mexico> Encenada and Rocarito along the coast..WOW..

So the story goes on till now the same old same old.
No matter who was President of the Apostolic Assembly, Brother Nava always had the "LAST AND FINAL WORD"
That is when Brother Efrain Valverde and Brother Nava "Locked horns in the Convention in the 1970 at the San Diego Concourse.

In the late l960's Brother Nava unfortaunately had an automobile accident on a dark night going home from church on the rainy night on Whittier Boulevard in East Los Angeles, California.

The woman crossing the "legal" cross walk was killed at DOA at Los Angeles General Hospital.
This terrible accident "neutralized" Brother Nava "a little tiny bit" had to move to Union City where he had "removed" a pastor there and set his son in law there till this day....

This is why Brother Baldemar had a "HEY" DAY FOR 23 years in the Board...because Brother Nava had been "nutralized" in other words a "LAME DUCK" as in Politics.

He lived to be over 100 years...GET THE PICTURE....GET IT GOOD. IT WILL TAKE REBUKING, PRAYER, FASTING AND MORE REBUKING...IN THE NAME OF JESUS TO TAKE THIS GENERATION CURSE AWAY FORVER IN THE NAME OF JESUS./

BROTHER NAVA NEVER WAS TRIED IN COURT BECAUSE BROTHER LUIS HERRERA WORKED IN COURT AND helped out.....

Maybe you will know why this has irrupted...Its been a loooonnnngggg
time due. God save...Many Pastors left, Brother Martinez, Brother Lupe Lara, when Brother Nava took his congregation...
They all learned and learned good..

R-E-S-P-E-C-T....E-A-R-N-I-T-!

A couple of things.

I noticed that the powers that be over at apostolicassembly.info removed the links to this and other blogs.

I thought it humorous that they say they want to use the Internet as a medium inform the constituents of the Apostolic Assembly and bring to light what was wronged (take it to the church) but when the light shines on their wrongs all of a sudden they want to turn off the lights again!

I don't think they liked what they were hearing. What should we read into that?

My heart was heavy as I was reading the round of comments on Saturday. It seemed as the comments turned from light jabs to an all out street fight. I saw names of people I forgot I had forgotten. Catarino Huizar? If anybody could cry over the pulpit it was him. I liked him, I tend to look at people apart from their ministry. We didn't have Starbucks back in those days, but if we did I could have great conversations with him over a cup of coffee. (Please don't bombard with details, I know all the stories...some not by choice.)

We are in a new era, an era of instant communication. The world is smaller. News instantaneous. Opinions heard. The voice of the masses can influence direction. I seriously doubt this generation will sit back and be intimidated by all powerful Oz pulling the ropes and levers behind the curtains. Leaders should and will be held accountable. Our leaders, at every level, better shape up, you are under more powerful microscope.

I've always felt uncomfortable with pastors and ministers demanding their respect (RESPECT: esteem, the condition of being honored). Respect is earned. I'm tired of pastors and ministers declaring their anointing. We serve the same God, we have the same Holy Spirit. Yours is not greater. Gifts and and talents are different. Before I give you my respect I want to know you as a person. Scripture dictates that we test all spirits to differentiate the true from false prophets.

You are human, you WILL fail. I expect that, so don't walk around like you are infallible. Romans 3:23 "for all (A)have sinned and fall short of the glory of GOD".

Teach your congregations what to do when you do fail. That is if you do have their best interest in mind. This will stop you from trying to cover up your mistakes. I guarantee you that when you do fall, your fellow believers will be there to help you out instead of throwing rocks and kicking you when your down or need their support.

Salvation and Stuff

Pride, Division and Power...Oh My!

As I stayed awake last night pondering what to write on the Apostolic News blog, my keyboard lied still, my thoughts still.
I started thinking, what are we doing? What is really going on? What is the purpose in all of this?

I've had very interesting conversations with my grandmother. She is clinging for life physcially but still very aware mentally. Her wisdom very profound. She does not look at things from a first person point of view, she has the ability to look at life from a macro level. The Big Picture. Now in her age she has no idea of what is going in her beloved church. (And I am afraid that if she did know, it would be enough to send her home.) So I, from her example, tried to look at our situation from the Google Earth/Maps perspective.

I actually opened Google Earth and did some traveling. I visited Rome as where the Christians where persecuted and the start of the inquisition a thousand or so years later. The Middle East, the location of the Byzantine Empire and Christian and Islam crusades. The deep south, Missisippi and Georia etc, where slaved where held captive. Germany and its involvement in aryan supremecy. Mexico where missionaries felt the need to convert the Aztec and the Mayan indians to Christianity to the point of death. And so on and on.

Where is all this going? A lot people have done a lot of crazy things in the name of God. But why?

It all comes down to the LUST FOR POWER. PRIDE.

After all we are not in this debacle because we disagree on doctrine, which is another reason why people do crazy things in the name of God. We all believe that Jesus came and died for our sins, we believe you must be born on the water and spirit to enter the Kingdom of heaven.

So it must be the LUST FOR POWER and PRIDE.

I know that the bible states that Satan is the Author of confusion. He would like nothing more than to divide you and I, the Valverdes from the Tafoyas, the Sanchez' from the Rodriguez' and so on and so on. Sift us like wheat. Real men of integrity should recognize this!

But I also came across the following verse: 1 Corinthians 1:10

Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment. For it hath been declared unto me of you, my brethren, by them which are of the house of Chloe, that there are contentions among you. Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ. Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?

Clearly Paul was talking the the church of Corinth but he might as well be talking to the Apostolic Assembly. Is divisiveness a sin? Do those involved in this matter cleary recognize the biblical implications?

However, scripture does take into account that there will be people who will take the God's Word and use it for their purpose and intention:

1 Corinthians 11:19

For there must also be factions among you, so that those who are approved may become evident among you. New American Standard Bible

Its reads a little clearer in the Weymouth New Testament:

For there must of necessity be differences of opinion among you, in order that it may be plainly seen who are the men of sterling worth among you.

Necessity? There MUST also be factions...divisions? Is what we are experiencing the same thing that Paul was talking about?

Should the focus be on building God's Kingdom or counting votes? Is PRIDE and LUST FOR POWER getting in the way of God's Kingdom?

.00216%

According several websites which track religious denomination statistics, it has been estimated that the Apostolic Assembly of the Faith in Christ Jesus is approximately 130,000 members (which, by the way, is 0.00216% of the total world population of approximately more than 6,000,000,000 people.)

(For all you trivia buffs - Moses brought more people out of Egypt then we have in our Assembly. The 12 tribes of Judah represent more people then we have in our assembly.)

Various challenges present themselves amongst our organization:

1. The requirement to minister to both in Spanish and English

The Assembly is predominately hispanic and its emphasis is on the spanish speaking individuals and families. Statistic show that the first generation hispanic's primary language is spanish. By the third generation the spanish language is almost not spoken or understood. However we continue to maintain the the emphasis in ministering in spanish while the future generations lose interest not for lack of desire but for lack of comprehension. Wiki states: "The newer generations do not always share the same cultural values and language as old and new migrant members".

2. "The [AAFCJ] denomination is also challenged by its organizational capability."

This an obvious statement by the mere fact of why we are reading these blogs because of our lack of organizational capability. The organizational leaders have failed (and not just the current leaders-many previous iterations of leaders are at fault) to developed the organizational leadership and management to provide a clear and defined path for growth and retention of its constituents. Because you have a good idea doesn't make it so, it is the processes and procedures and consistent actions by realizing strengths and addressing weaknesses. Through a simple SWOT analysis I can tell right off the bat our threats and weaknesses but we (leaders) do not want to admit and much less address them.

3. HOLD ON TO YOUR SEATS,THIS ONE IS GOING TO HURT:

"The Apostolic Assembly is challenged to raise it's educational and theological levels. This is due to that initiation and ordination rules are not as demanding in this area as they are in other Oneness Pentecostal Denominations, thus raising the probabilities of ministerial unpreparedness to congregational and spiritual needs".

We love popularity contests. We love the flashy suits, the shiny cars and smooth talkers and crooners. But look where that has gotten us: Right smack dab in the middle of two groups of flashy suit wearing, shiny car driving, smooth talking, popular vote getting politicians.
Are those flashy suits, shiny cars and smooth talker fit to lead our organization? Let's look for some substance - education, experience, vision and ability to develop processes and procedures for membership retention.

Organizational Management - I've taken many classes on the topic, I've practiced and implemented many theories to varying success. I know what it is and I know what it is not. Please don't be surprised when I tell you this is what is it is not!

(I know a young man in Lordsburg, NM who is studying at Harvard. I will be willing to wage that there will be corporations that will be vying for his education, knowledge and skills. They know that in the long run he will benefit their corporations strategic growth plans. Let's recruit him and those like him, move them into positions where we can learn and benefit from them. Oh but no, he's to young and doesn't have gift of pulpit pimpology. ...Wait a minute who are the ones getting pimped? But that is another topic).

One of our problems is that we turn inward for help. We assume that we, the 0.00216% of the world population, have all the answers - theologically, organizationally, socially, and what ever other "lly's" you want put in yourself. We fail to strive for the best.

As a matter of fact, our best strive for the best...and move on.

Let's look at things from a different perspective,

How many members have we LOST?

How many members have we hurt because of our ignorance?

Have many members have gone AWOL?

How many members have gone MIA?

How many members have we kicked out?

How many more members are we willing to sacrifice?

Is some one keeping track?

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apostolic_Assembly_of_the_Faith_in_Christ_Jesus

There's A New Sheriff In Town?

Who in the world is going to want the [General Board] job, now?

I predict with the introduction of blogs and increased scrutiny of elections and those in power, the job may be less desirable. Imagine the day after the election, now with blogs and I imagine other emerging online information sites about the AA, leaders must now consider what those that run for public office consider before their elections: public scrutiny. And there is nothing wrong with that!

If you want to run an organization like the AA, you better have an impeccable resume, an above par family, and high standard of professional readiness (ethical business practices). To put it bluntly, the new AA leadership should be expected to stand the scrutiny of bloggers with way too much time on their hands at work, with way too much bandwidth, with way too much intricate knowledge on how to mine for the internet for information.

Shouldn't we expect anything less?

In case you forgot, this is the Apostolic Church.

For all these people feeling sorry for all these leaders getting their names dragged through these bastions of incredible wit and analysis (the comment sections of these blogs), I say to you that this may be the new price of AA leadership.

You can't expect to walk across that platform in all the grace and glory that the position brings without the expectation that you better be living and leading in a manner worthy of the accolades. Maybe the emergence of these blogs and the hypercritic it brings will dwindle down the leadership ranks to those that don’t have any shady dealings to uncover, or resume to question.

Do I suggest that the blogs now have the ability to dictate Apostolic leadership? No!

But, it does raise the level of scrutiny that a leader must be comfortable with if he so desires the office of…

Author: Apostolico

I WANT YOU!!

I would like to extend an invitation to a interested parties and viewers to this site and allow FEATURED BLOG posting to those who can articulate in clear and captive tone their thoughts on where we come from and where we are going. This is your chance to help influence the leadership of the AAFCJ. The General Board has their communication channel via their website as does those seeking legal action (those links can be seen to the right panel of this website). This is for your voice to be heard. From the abundance the your heart should your mouth speak(matt: 12:34 paraphrased)...or in this case...type.

There is an old lawyers adage that says: "If you can't win on the law, argue the facts. If you can't win on the facts, attack the character of your opponent".

When one directly attacks those they disagree with, they are clearly showing they do not have either the law or the facts on their side or they are just blatantly ignorant and their comments should be taken as such.

You can touch on any subject as it relates to our beloved organization and your blog will be moderated and edited for its content. The extent of my editing will be for grammar to make sure your blog is focused. I will not censor your position. (Disclaimer: If I feel your blog is boring, long winded, lacks focus or purely for the intent of character assasination, it will not be posted). Your writing should inspire diaglogue and discussion.

Those interested in adding dialogue will allowed to remain anonymous if you wish. Please address your interest, comments and concerns to: apostolicvoice@gmail.com

Apostolic Assembly 2006 Election Irregularities

COMMENTS HAVE BEEN DISABLED IN THIS SECTION. FEEL FREE TO COMMENT IN THE LATEST BLOG. Apostolic Voice

The election irregularities of the 2006 General Convention impact the members of its organization in different ways. After seeing the way this has been used for a one sided discussion, it is imperative that an unbiased view be allowed to moderate its discussion.

For those that are aware of the legal implications and jockeying, please feel free to add your opinion here. As previous stated, this site will be moderated for its content.