D-Day has arrived hermanos. In an effort to continue discussions I am bumping the Elections comments thread to this section. Please feel free to post your comments here. We will suspend comments in the previous sections.
As you were...
Apostolic Voice
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«Oldest ‹Older 401 – 600 of 1271 Newer› Newest»Sam your goffy! He doesnt have an RV.
That's whats wrong with our Assembly unless its a convention, a Conference, some miracle on the wayside. Healings, slain in the spirit or in some prison. It isnt good enough.
You know what? God sent us to preach the Gospel. Bishop Torres did just that in a mission in Big Spring Texas.
They may not be important to you Sammy or to your beloved Sam Valverde because there is not spotlight but they are souls and God loves them. So...quit kissing up to the man so much!
Snickers, I agree with you. Sis Dahlia is also actively helping other cancer patients across the nation. I am told the blogmaster is being contacted by an attorney to get the address for those who were attacking the Torres family yesteday.
IT DOESN'T REALLY MATTER IF I'M FROM ODESSA, MIDLAND OR EL PASO, OR FROM AFRICA, DOES IT. WHAT MATTERS IS THE TRUTH AND ONCE PEOPLE QUOTE THE TRUTH IT HURTS.
HERES THIS: "LA VERDAD NO PECA PERO SI QUE INCOMODA"
I wonder if apostolic blood is going to try and sneak their way out of this one just like sam. lol
PORFAVOR I DONT HAVE TO SNEAK OUT OF ANYTHING. TODO LO PUEDO EN CRISTO QUE ME FORTALECE!!!!
APOSTOLIC BLOOD
I dont know who you are but by your post you basically admitted indirectly that you were from one of the three cities.
Come on, I mean you attack someone who is a Cancer Survivor. I am not trying to attack you or put you down. Forgive me if I have but "we" and I include myself, need to have some integrity.
Lets leave her out, Lets leave Valverdes family out, Aguilars family out and every other man of Gods family out.
SNICKERS
THAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN DONE SINCE THE BEGINNING IF NO ONE HAD ATTACKED THE VALVERDES, THE AGUILAR FAMILY THEN NO ONE WOULD HAVE MENTIONED ANY NAMES.
BUT WE SHOULD HAVE LEFT NAMES OUT.
IT WOULD HAVE AVOIDED SO MUCH OF THIS MESS.
AND YES AT ONE TIME I WAS MEMBER OF WEST TEXAS DISTRICT, IF IT HAS TO BE KNOWN.BUT NOW I RESIDE IN CALIFORNIA.
APOSTOLIC BLOOD
You seem like a good person. I dont doubt that but as far as other people mentioning names, we have no control over that.
I mean lets think about this, the blogs probably have people from ages 14 and 15 posting comments to Ministers, Pastors and even Bishops who are 50 and 60 years old! Maybe older! My point is, we dont know who comes on to post comments, young or old, immature or no maturity at all.
We have no control over who makes comments. But you can control you.
Dont make comments about someone elses family just because some immature kid or immature Bishop makes a comment. Lets have integrity.
Sis Dahila, is she perfect? No, but am I? No. Are you? No.
And as i have said before, she is a cancer survivor. One who fought for her life and almost lost but she won and was able to rebound and get her life back.
All the Pastors and Bishops who are involved in this are open game because they have caused this dilemma, but Pastors wives? Lets, let them be.
Can we stop all the fighting?
Can we stop all the fighting?
There is a loss of Unity in our Assembly. It is evident in my district. Does anybody care?
APOSTOLIC BLOOD
I dont mean to pick on you. But God doesnt give us "Fortaleza" to bring someone down? Does he? Only if its evil or anti-God. Just a question, dont mean to fight.
JUST CAUSE I AM POSTING A TRUTH EXPERIENCE IN MY LIFE DOES NOT MAKE ME EVIL OR ANTICRIST. I AM ONE OF THE ONES THAT PRAYED FOR SIS TORRES WHEN SHE WAS SICK. I DONT WITH HER ANY HARM I'M NOT THAT DUMB. I WOULD BE WISHING IT UPON MYSELF. GET OVER IT AND DONT TAKE IT PERSONAL. SHE DID HURT SOME PEOPLE WITH THAT STRONG CHARACTER THAT YOU GUYS CALL IT. WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IF WE ALL HAD THAT STRONG CHARACTER LIKE SHE HAS. WE WOULD END UP KILLING EACH OTHER.
APOSTOLIC BLOOD
Sister,
Read my post again, I didnt call you the anti-christ or evil. Just asked a question.
What did Sis. Dahlia do to you? Did you gals get into it at the Dorcas camp? Okay, God Bless
PLEASE NOTE:
FOR THE RECORD, EVEN THOUGH COMMENTORS CAN DELETE THEIR OWN COMMENTS FOR WHATEVER REASON...THEY ARE RECORDED AND CAN BE STILL ACCESSED BY THE ADMINSTRATOR(BLOGMASTER).
PLEASE THINK TWICE BEFORE HITTING THE "PUBLISH YOUR COMMENT" BUTTON AND DO NOT WRITE SOMETHING YOU MAY LATER WANT TO RETRACT.
Dios les pague.
ApostolicVoice
Blogmaster
SNICKERS,
I APOLOGIZE, REALLY I MEAN IT. BUT IT WOULD'NT HELP ANY IF I GOT INTO DETAILS. LETS JUST LEAVE IT AT THAT. I NEVER HAD A PROBLEM WITH SIS TORRES AT NO CAMP. BUT I CERTAINLY DONT WANT TO AIR OUT THE DETAILS, IT CERTAINLY WOULD NOT HELP THE SITUATION ANY.
LETS JUST PRAY FOR EACH OTHER AND FOR THE WHOLE CHURCH HOPING GOD WILL DO JUSTICE AND THAT WE ACCEPT WHATEVER HIS DECISION MAY BE AS JUSTICE. THAT HE HELP US ALL ACCEPT THE DECISION OF THE COURT WHAT EVER IT MAY BE--HOPEFULLY WE WILL ACCEPT IT AS WHAT GOD WANTS FOR HIS CHURCH.
APOSTOLIC VOICE
I am at your mercy! Please have mercy on me!
APOSTOLIC BLOOD
Sister,
You know what? I can agree to that, lets just pray. I believe that we can post comments, just in an orderly and decent manner. Lets us pray for both sides and pray for their families also.
God Bless
It takes all kinds of people to run this world or in this case our Assembly. Some people are strong of character but that doesn't mean they are bad. If we were all meek and sat back and just let things roll, lots of things wouldn't get done or lots of things would be gotten away with. Some people also have strong voices that are authoritative and request attention. I bet a lot of us, and I include myself, many a time have wished that we could have that strong voice to speak up and be heard in order to defend someone, our children, ourselves, etc. I greatly admire that person who can speak with authority. Just because you have a voice that carries authority and demands attention doesn't mean you are hollering at people, although it may sound that way to some.
I understood this about Sis. Dahlia Torres a long time ago, heck we've even had to ask her help in getting the attention at events where we don't have a mike. (Luv you Sis. Dahlia!) She has a voice that carries and she uses it well, such as in song, glorifying God and yes to request attention. I have a son who has the same "gift" and I constantly have to tell him not to yell, and every single time he states "I'M NOT YELLING". I love him, he can't help himself, that's his voice.
Sis Dahlia, don't ever change. We need your assertiveness and your voice in making yourself heard. Thank you for being a blessing to us. God Bless.
Sammy, WHERE ARE YOU!!!
I think he's busy looking for an attorney.
Sammy doesn't know what an attorney is. All Sammy can read is 4 letter words!!!! Dumb ...ss!
It's quiet, too quiet, like the quiet before the storm, or maybe it's the quiet after yesterday's storm.
I don't think the blogmaster meant for us not to post anymore just don't tell lies, you know, cause that's a CRIME punishable by law. I guess it's making us all think twice. That's good. God bless us.
cbg
Can you give us more information about Tim Valverde and his girlfriend? I thought he was about to be married what happen? .
I just think people are tired of fighting. The elections have really put people at odds.
I say we are spiritual but we cant even work out our differences. How godly can we be if we are at odds with one another?
Revision on above comment:
"... a crime punishable by "secular humanistic" law."
RE: CAN I HAVE YOUR ATTENTION PLEASE??
RE: CAN I HAVE YOUR ATTENTION PLEASE??
This blog has lost it's effectiveness. Many are just bickering, which causes us to just skim over those posts in search for any news, updates or mature convo's.
Come on guys stop behaving like apos and have a conversation with meaning. Seems like the only thing apos are good for is bickering, fashion and dating. Let's stimulate our brains for once!
As someone said a while back I think we’re just filling up space until something happens. We’re like little kids with nothing to do, just being rowdy. Some take it a little too far.
I wonder what the GB is up to. Someone said they were having a meeting and "looking for blood!" Has anyone heard anything yet? I bet they're still thinking about that $24 million!
Repus, that name sounds like some kind of genital infection. Who ever you are "Repus", why don't you do some thing a little more creative and rethink a new name for yourself. If this blog has lost its meaning, then by all means, post some thing intellectual. Or even spritiual. Maybe you can call old Abel Torres, who's on his RV Tour of the Texas Plains, Oh, I mean in the mission fields, and ask him how the Whatta Burgers are in Midland Texas.
My sources on the inside tell me that there is a change coming to Texas. There is hope for Texas because some brothers from California are going to be sent to replace some pastors in Texas. This will be to show you people how church is really and effectively done. Your old ways in Texas are not goood. They lead to nowhere. Like Bishops filing frivilous lawsuits against there own apostolic church which is a sin because you cause great divisive sins by dividing the church against itself.
CBG, you don't know me. If you did know me then you would know that know body, and I mean NOBODY messes with me and gets away with it. I said before, you were never one of us and now you will never be. Dont be spreading false lies about Tim either or you will be dealt with in my prayers.
I prayed for justice for the church, and the prayers I made was answered.
Hi Sam,
As someone else stated so eloquently, "You have proven yourself to be a menso again."
My handle "repus" means SUPER spelled backwards. Of course, with your traditional apostolic way of thinking, you were only able to associate that name with something negative and perverted - you are the epitome of the apostolic mentality.
I refuse to have a conversation with you, so do not bother responding.
Where is that new mega church in Los Angeles?
We have been let down by leaders we used to look up to.
Even when the truth came out, instead of admitting fault and ask for us to forgive them, they took the low road and started to black ball people. Even though they won the court's verdict, by no way is it right before God.
I guess thats why we are all angry, mad, and upset by whats going on, but that does not give as the right to put down our brothers and sisters in Christ. ( I'm the first to say I'm guilty of it 2)
Sam telling Repus, that her name sounds like some kind of genital infection was way out of line.
Hopefully from this day forth we can all treat each other with respect, and even knowing that we all have different opinions we can all respect that 2.
A quick suggestion for the purposes of discussion here...let's not respond to Sam. He is clearly yanking the chain of many of the bloggers here and seems to be enjoying it. The more fuel you give him, the more he is going to yank. Practice self restraint and move beyond and do not engage him. He hasn't added any value anyhow.
And he is making the pro-GB people look bad. He could be a double agent trying to make the pro-GB look bad.
No need to comment on my comment, please make note and move on.
JC
RE: Should we use secular resources?
Do you guys think it is correct for the AA to solicit the services of for-profit businesses that provide help in order to better a business' financial and management system?
There is the school of thought that it is God who manages the church and the Assembly has no business soliciting secular entities for assistance.
Would be it appropriate to say that the health of the AA can be compared to the health of a Christian individual? If your heart is failing, you go a heart surgeon. If the heart of an organization is failing, why not go to an expert?
Do both analogies apply? Does using secular experts for management consultation threaten the AA's dependency on God?
A German retiree is taking a hospital to court after she went in for a leg operation and got a new anus instead, the Daily Telegraph is reporting.
The woman woke up to find she had been mixed up with another patient suffering from incontinence who was to have surgery on her sphincter.
The clinic in Hochfranken, Bavaria, has since suspended the surgical team.
Now the woman is planning to sue the hospital. She still needs the leg operation and is searching for another hospital to do it.
This is a good example of the elections in 2006, pastors when for a new GB instead they.....
DUBAI (Reuters) - Al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden threatened the European Union with grave punishment over the re-publication of cartoons of Islam's Prophet Mohammad that Muslims saw as offensive.
Bin Laden in an audio recording posted on the Internet said that the drawings which were published by Danish and other newspapers were part of a "crusade" in which the Catholic Pope was involved.
----------------------------------
SOUNDS LIKE BIN LADEN IS ON THE AA GENERAL BOARD. MAYBE HE WAS TAUGHT BY SANCHEZ HIMSELF.
CBG,
If it is true that you can be liable for posting lies on the net, you need to be careful about what you say about others. In reference to Timo and his fiance, you mentioned that "she had been around the block?" Sir, I happen to know her and she is nothing like what you are making her to be. You are GUILTY of character assasination. As for their relationship? It is great.
Rancho Cucamonga (Apostolic News) - Asamblea leader Daniel Sanchez threatened the District Leaders with grave punishment over the re-publication of cartoons of Apostolic's Prophet Antonio Nava that Apostolics saw as offensive.
Sanchez in an audio preaching posted on the Internet said that the drawings which were published by Apostolic News and other newspapers were part of a "crusade" in which the Apostolic Reformers were involved.
__________________________
SEE THE SIMILARITIES? OSAMA SANCHEZ
CBG, This is what you posted. I hope you have some evidence to cover yourself for this attack.
By the way if you think Timo and Sal are men of God, then you trully are GAY! I personally know Sal and why he came back from Arizona (beat his wife). And you and I know that Timo's girfriend has been around different blocks with him many times.
Maybe you're just jealous that Timo pays more attention to her than to you. Dumb ...ss!!!
March 17, 2008 6:01 PM
CBG,
I am still waiting for the proof you have of who you think "sam" is?
I believe you are nothing more than a habitual fabricator of lies.
If 'sam' did lie about Mr Torres, then the two of you will be swimming up the sam creek!
CBG, if you really know me, and I think you don't, but in case you do, you better not tell anyone who am I. As the saying goes, the pandeluom swings both ways. You out me, and I'll out you. I now know who you are and don't think for one minute I can call my peeps on the inside and have your reported to the board.
You better think twice because you better. But it really dont not matter now cause I know and you know we have dirt on each other and we can both stay clean if we clean eachother up. I wash you and you wash me. I'll promise to keep on the down low.
As for you Texans, I leave you and your buddah idol Abel to your Whatta Burgers while he travels the Texas plains in his Winnebego, RV, going to service to service doing nothing.
ok.. what the heck is wrong with whataburger..??? lol
seriously... they make a pretty good burger... geez.. now even then whatburger is getting a hit job from the GB.. lol
but some1 just made a good point... this blog is becoming the apostolic enquirer... when it used ot be the Apostolic (NEW YORK) Times....
does any1 have any updates whatsoever?
Update
4th District, Division Two
The 4th Appellate District, Division 2 is located at:
3389 Twelfth Street
Riverside, CA 92501
Phone: (951) 248-0200
Tee Time and Sam,
Your mentality is just like that of the GB. You must think you're dealing with one of your peeps. First of all I am well versed regarding law and what constitutes slander or not! So save your breath.
As far as your quote Tee Time, "I am still waiting for the proof you have of who you think "sam" is? I believe you are nothing more than a habitual fabricator of lies. If 'sam' did lie about Mr Torres, then the two of you will be swimming up the sam creek!" Pleeeaaasssee! KEEP WAITING - read my lips, I DON'T HAVE TO PROVE ANYTHING TO YOU! People like Sam show their true colors by the way they talk. At least my excuse is that I'm not a Christian. WHAT'S YOURS AND SAMS!
As far as Sams quote, "CBG, you don't know me. If you did know me then you would know that know body, and I mean NOBODY messes with me and gets away with it." What kind of a Christian talks that way? What ever happened to Scriptures like, "You have heard that it was said, 'Love your neighbor and hate your enemy. But I tell you: Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous." Matthew 5:43-45 (NIV).
At least I am what I profess to be, but you two are nothing more than "...hypocrites! You clean the outside of the cup and dish, but inside they are full of greed and self-indulgence. Blind Pharisee! First clean the inside of the cup and dish, and then the outside also will be clean. Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You are like whitewashed tombs, which look beautiful on the outside but on the inside are full of dead men's bones and everything unclean. In the same way, on the outside you appear to people as righteous but on the inside you are full of hypocrisy and wickedness." Matthew 23-28 (NIV).
To all bloggers,
What kind of Christian writes stuff like this, "You better think twice because you better. But it really dont not matter now cause I know and you know we have dirt on each other and we can both stay clean if we clean eachother up. I wash you and you wash me. I'll promise to keep on the down low. So called Christians from FTC. I think I'll mail this quote to Valverde to see what he thinks. Sam you dumb ...ss!
Tee time
Quote, "CBG, Send his identity to tremendo777@yahoo.com" Don't you think I could figure out who you were. Amateur I knew you were one of Sams peeps just fishing for information. What a moron! No wander the AA is in the mess it is - with people like you! Dumb ...ss #2!
Ju 4 all
Su comentario sobre el CID estuvo muy informativo y le agradecemos su esfuerzo en haber explicado tan bien el proceso que se llevo acabo por Sanchez y Martin del Campo.
UD le dice a los Pastores que en la union esta la fuerza eso bien lo sabemos.
A la vez les dice que “ABRAN LOS OJOS” pero yo le digo a UD, que mejor les diga que habrá las bocas y cierren sus cuentas bancarias a los zánganos en lo que incluye el diezmo de diezmos.
Tambien les dice a los Pastores que se llamen por teléfono y se comuniquen vÃa el Internet o como sea posible, y que se informen unos con otros del cuerpo ministerial como fueron engañados por Sanchez y Martin del Campo sobre el CID.
Acuerdese que estos Pastores no se confian uno al otro, porque algunos al oir algo, van inmediatamente a Sanchez y le informan.
Esto lo podemos ver en la historia de la iglesia apostólica que el fraude y trucos sobre elecciones y posiciones ministeriales fueron y han sido la forma similar a la inquisición que se ha usado por años.
La verdad es, y lo digo con tristeza, que nunca los Pastores Apostólicos de la Asamblea se unirán con una voz y voto por falta de valentÃa al enfrentarse con estos hombres que dizque son ‘siervos de Dios’ y en realidad son lobos rapaz que vienen en busca de sangre.
¿Quien les a dado la autoridad de mandar Pastores de California a Texas después que se han portado sin temor de Dios ni en forma cristiana? La Palabra de Dios claramente dice, “…el que aborrece a su hermano es un homicida.” ¿Y como pueden decir que aman a Dios y aborrecen a su hermano?
La verdad es que muchos Pastores y miembros se van a unir a la Iglesia Apostólica de México que están prosperando mucho en los Estados Unidos, o a otras Iglesias Apostólicas libres.
Muchos dicen que la mesa directiva tiene todo derecho de hacer las elecciones como las hicieron en Long Beach.
Pero ellos aprendieron muy bien con Baldermar RodrÃguez que por 23 largos años, reinó de Presidente a Vicepresidente usando las mismas tácticas de la calificadora. Y todos los que han estado en la mesa directiva y que han demandado a la asamblea, hicieron lo mismo.
El remedio para este problema es realmente imposible para que se solucione por medio de los pastores.
Hay un hermano, Raul Murillo, residente de Monterrey, Nuevo Leon, Mexico, que es secretario general de la mesa directiva de la Mesa Directiva de Mexico y de los EEUU, que es profesor en la Universidad Autonoma de Monterrey y a la vez es abogado de leyes.
Dios lo esta usando grandemente en revisar y re edificar la constitucion de la Iglesia Apostolica de Mexico.
El Hno Murillo seria una grande bendicion para la Iglesia Apostolica de la Fe en Cristo Jesus para ayudar a formula una Constitucion mas concreta y correcta como el juez demando en este mes.
Pero, tragicamente, agradeciendo a Baldemar, la Iglesia de Mexico y la Asamblea Apostolica de EEUU no tiene comunion una con la otra.
I just realized this - I PROBABLY KNOW MORE BIBLE THAN TEE TIME AND SAM TOGETHER! And I'm not even a Christian!
hey yall whose going to the Texa regionals Im about to leave yay so exited hope to see some of yall out there =) God Bless!
CBG,
If you are NOT Christian why do you read the Bible ?
Why waste time reading and learning about something you dont believe in ?
CBG, I guess this means we are cool then. Thanks. I'll lay off now.
Have a blessed day you all. In-N-Out beats Whata Burger any day.
Oh, to all bloggers, I was just shaking your feathers to rile you up. I don't even know Rev. Abel Torres, but I'm sure he's a good man seeing how all of you back him up.
Its NCAA Tournament Time and I have a lot of basketball to watch over the next 2 weeks.
Bye Bye!
Teetime, See you at the next GB5 concert. Save me my tickets.
Sam are you Van by any chance?
Where's my lythium? lol
Enrique,
Quote, "If you are NOT Christian why do you read the Bible? Why waste time reading and learning about something you dont believe in?"
Maybe I read it BECAUSE I'M SERCHING for something. Shouldn't your comment be, "Keep on reading the Bible maybe some day it will change you!" No wander SOME apostolics are so wack!!!!
CBG,
Dont get me wrong.
I was just curious why you criticise christianity yet seem intrigued by it at the same time.
I am not here to convince anyone about anything.
And you are right some Apostolics are wack. But so are some human beings in general.
It is human nature to be flawed THAT my friend is why you need Christ.
We all need Christ to be redeemed and saved.
On our own we sin, fall, act hipocritically and blow it all the time.
The difference CBG with those who have given their lives to God and those who dont believe is that we have a nmerciful God to appeal to who has died for our sins.
And those who do not believe are alone and stand condemned.
But we all fall short and sin.
Enrique,
Listen, I've been around Christians most of my life, and I guess this is ONE of the reasons why I haven't given my life to the Lord! I've seen and heard to many so called Christians like Sam and Tee Time talk and act JUST LIKE my sinner friens in the world. These people seem to think it is OK for them to play with people's feeling and emotions - What kind of true Christian DOES THAT! When I se them and my friends outside of church the only diference I see is that my sinner friends don't claim to know the Lord and His truth! But everything else is the same.
I also understand that a few wishy washy Christians does not represent the whole of Christianity - I KNOW THAT! All religions and denominations have their bad apples. I do visit FTC and have seen people like Sam, Timo, and Sal say one thing but do another. I know people there (Edna, Sal, Isaiah, Julian, Elida) but get discouraged when I see the like's of the Valverde offspring and see arrogance (believe me NOT every one in this chrch agrees with Valverde). Even when GB members come to visit, you can actually FEEL the pride permanating from their being.
Anyway, I know I need the Lord, and hopefully soon I will give my heart to the Lord, but I'm still searching for a church. I also stay around Jesus Name Christians (not only the AA) because they seem to have a better grasp in the whole truth of the Scriptures.
Pray for me Enrique, that soon I too will repent of my ways and join the elect few. Cause God knows I NEED THE LORD REAL BAD! GBY.
CBG
CBG,
I will pray for you my brother.
And I encourage you to give your life to God.
Not all of us Apo's are of the same mindset.
There is really no good reason not to accept The Lord's wonderful free gift of Salvation.
You dont have to wait to be good enough or til your living right.
Come as you are and God will do the rest.
And there will always be bad examples of half repented and carnal christians.But if you keep your eyes on God he will direct your paths to the way everlasting.
finally something positive, in the middle of our despair God still do miracles. God bless you CBG.
A los Pastores y sus Esposas y el Cuerpo ministerial.
Se le esta invitando a la Convención Nacional de la Iglesia Apostólica de México que da principio, mañana, Viernes, 21 de Marzo.
La registración principia a las 4:30 pm en el:
Hotel Westin
12720 Merit Drive,
Dallas, Texas 75251
Teléfono: (800) 937-8461
ComunÃquese con el
Obispo Presidente Hno. Gaxiola
Secretario General, Raúl Murillo
Obispo de Calif, Samuel Aguilar
Obispo de Washington, Mauro Rubalcava
Obispo de Arizona, Joel Aguilar
Obispo de El Paso, Texas, Joel Mireles
Si esta cansado de Sánchez, Valverde, Pacheco, Baldemar RodrÃguez y Daniel Salomón, etc...
y quiere trabajar por la obra de Dios y formar sus raÃces propias con una iglesia que tiene fundamentos BÃblicos y Apostólicos,
venga a unirse con estos hermanos que desean formar dicipulado y traer almas al Reino de Dios.
Ya deje de sufrir por asuntos polÃticos y carnales, venga a gozarse.
La Convención es desde el viernes a Domingo, 21 al 23.
Viernes y sábado de las 5 PM hasta las 9:30 de la noche.
Domingo (reuniones comienzan a las 10 AM- clausura, 1 PM)
'Esfuerzate y se valiente, yo Jehová iré contigo donde quiera que fueres.'
Allà nos veremos con la ayuda de Dios, mañana viernes, 21 de Marzo.
Que Dios les Bendiga, y siga adelante.
CBG,
WOW! You have been hurt bad.
I know many non-Christian folks that don't talk or act like you so save the excuse as to why you act the way you do. Just grow up. Stop using the excuse that you see so many hypocrites in church. You have the bible, you obviously read it, so there is no excuse for you. I will also pray for you. I pray that God will surround you with Godly men and women from whom you will learn to be a servant of Christ.
**SAM**
I already have the tickets, autographed by Isaac!!!
Tee Time,
You are a perfect example of what I have been talking about, and you're so dumb and self centered to even understand!
Your quote, "I know many non-Christian folks that don't talk or act like you so save the excuse as to why you act the way you do. Just grow up. Stop using the excuse that you see so many hypocrites in church. You have the bible, you obviously read it, so there is no excuse for you." ARE YOU BLIND OR STUPID? I'm not manking escuses. I admittted I'm angry and bitter and it is no one elses fault but mine.
You on the other hand, cannot and will not admit that you are heartless, proud, self-centered, egocentric, and out right a Pharisee!
Quote, "I will also pray for you. I pray that God will surround you with Godly men and women from whom you will learn to be a servant of Christ." Please do that, and I believe this is the reason God exposed your presence to me SO I WOULD NOT BE SURROUNDED BY PEOPLE LIKE YOU!
Maybe opening my eyes to people like you at FTC is an answer to your prayer that "God will surround you with Godly men and women from whom you will learn to be a servant of Christ." Surely your NOT ONE OF THE, because by your words ONLY I would want NOTHING TO DO WITH YOU AND THE god YOU SERVE!
Think on this, "Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted. Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ." Galatians 6:1-2.
"D-Day! 2006 General Election Irregularities...
That is the main point of this section of the blog. We have turned it into a tit-for-tat with childish things. Let's grow up and blog some informative stuff.
Does anybody have access to the final court's rendering which was read on March 10th by Judge Kayashima?
justice_will_prevail:
""Let's grow up and blog some informative stuff.""
Are you serious?
Basically, you are saying lets grow up and post some information that is going to make the church look bad. Lets blog some chisme to rip people's reputation.
How grown up is that?
GET A FREEKING CLUE!!
The best outcome for the plaintiff's in this case is nothing more than a New Election.
You seem to make it as if some investigation, such as Watergate, will uncover some secrets of the general board.
You want some informative news? Here you go.
April 25th, The El Monte Dorcas will be having a Concina after church. Donation, $7.00
May 1st, The MOP will be raising money by e-offering for its scholarship fund.
Sonny, its time to forget this election and move on to the next election. But what does it matter, the people have no voice. The ones who have a voice, pastors, can have their voices silenced by the QC.
In essence, the ones who voted to amend the constitution created a Dictatorship.
Give me the days of good old politicing where politics played everything out. At least deals were made and people's interest were met.
Now, Sanchez/Valverde are like Fidel Castro and Ramon Castro.
Democracy is dead in the Asamblea. The people have no voice but are Taxed at 10% plus offerings.
We are taxed and have no representation nor do we even do charity as an organization. The AA, as a form of government Stinks.
This lawsuit, the organization to mobilize the hermanos was a huge Brain Fart. ie Youth for Change.
I agree change needs to happen, but it wont happen in this procedural manner.
So, lets grow up and get real.
Van
So what are your ideas for a possible solution?
I personally don't think the lawsuit was in vain. Maybe not a win in the courts but certainly not a real loss for the betterment of the Assembly because it has opened the eyes of many. And maybe not overnite but gradually things will begin to change. (positive thinking here!) I think it has brought attention to some very real problems, because as we all know it isn't just the alleged fraud of the 2006 elections. There appear to be many other issues that have been brought to light which should be addressed.
Maybe committees can be set up to handle each major problem and then perhaps committees to overlook those committees. Sort of a checks and balances system. Someone to insure that "flor azul" funds are used for aid to our missionaries, etc., not just pile all the money up at headquarters.
Just some thoughts, I'm not as intelligent as some but I think sometimes things are made more difficult than they really are.
I sincerely doubt that any of the people involved want to leave the Assembly all they appear to want is a change for the better for our Assembly. I think we all want that. If, and this is a big IF, only our leaders would listen. SIGH!
At this point, we just need to start developing a strategy for the next election.
I'm not talking about secret meetings. People need to be lobbied. Issues need to be openly dealt with. The membership of the church needs to have its voice heard.
When have the members ever had their concerns heard by the general board? We are treated as dumb sheep.
Even with this lawsuit, were the members ever consulted? Did the plaintiffs ever attempt to gather grassroots support? No. We had these psuedo groups like "Youth for Justice", which some say was really Saul Avila and or Art Tafoya. I for one didn't believe this because most AA youth are more concerned about thier myspace than they are about church government.
No, I think the plaintiffs need to move on and try to influence the next round of elections. They had their opportunity to deal with these elections back when they were on the board. Now they are just beening sore losers and are doing more to hurt the church than to help it.
Its not like morale in the AA is at an all time high. Its time to cut your losses and move on. But this time, get more people involved.
I for one, think we need more information on our leaders, their complete, honest backgrounds, minus the hype, ie Valverde, Pacheco. If they were involved in a scandal, it should be known.
That way, they are transparent. We see them for who they really are. With their 8 or so high end real estate holdings, ie Pacheco.
Or how they appointed their friends and family to positions and gave them AA money to buy property, ie Aguilars.
And of course, we need to put some teeth behind this. Thus, the days of hiding behind anonymous Handle names, fake identities will have to end.
One Day, you will really know who Van is. As if I am really Van Johnson.
Hello we_care,
Regarding change and the impossibility of change in the AA, you asked that we should be more positive.
Well, it's not about being positive. It's about being realistic. When a leader is convinced that HIS way of thinking has been divinely inspired by God and to change that in any way would jeopardize your salvation, you end up with a leader who refuses to change or listen to any possibility of change.
You cannot break through a person when they feel that they're way of thinking parallels God's way of thinking. They refuse to believe that perhaps, God speaks to others other than themselves.
If this mentality continues, which I'm positive it will, do not expect any changes. It is your children and grandchildren who will have to deal with this junk all over again just as us grandchildren are having to do right now.
CBG,
This is my last response to you. It seems that all you can do is name call. That's fine. I will continue to pray for you wether you like it or not. In the family of Christ not everyone gets along but we still love each other. And despite what you think of me or anyone else, you still need God.
By the way, what makes you think I am from FTC? Not that it matters, but I was just curious.
Anyway CBG, LATERS!!!
Come Again,,, yes you should go to the church in Midland, so you know you can't speak your mind without being call a mal arrepentido or rebelde because you ask questions especially about the finances of the church or any elections that should be done every year which we haven't had in many years.
Brother Sanchez should have advised and encouraged his board to step down, right along him, in the very beginning. They should have allowed for an investigative committee to look into the matter, in the very beginning. Truth of the matter is that the GB knew they had cheated their way into positions and didn’t care. They didn’t think it would ever come out and that NO ONE would ever have the audacity to question them, expose them, and least of all, sue them. They had AMPLE time to rectify this situation. Ample time to come clean and come out with some shred of dignity. Should have, could have, would have . . . if only.
If Brother Pacheco had any ounce of true love for the work of the Lord and any love for this organization, that has been his bread and butter for so long mind you, he should have been the FIRST to step down even before Brother Sanchez should have advised it. He is at the root of this fiasco. He is at the root of this immanent division. How can he accept a position that he didn’t rightfully attain? That alone speaks volumes about his character. But then can you expect any more from a man that is surrounded by so much controversy? His testimony has been tainted from years ago! It should weigh heavy on him that he is at the cause of this debacle. But a person like him is too proud and arrogant to ever admit or show that he was wrong.
The people of Israel were supposed to reach the Promised Land in 40 days, but God allowed them to wander in the desert for 40 years. Why? Even though He knew, God wanted to know what was in their hearts. He saw no good. Two people from the generation that started made it to the Promised Land. The AA is not the only organization going through a cleansing process. Many organizations are. Why? Sign of the times. God wants to see what is in the hearts of His church. God has allowed this to happen. He is cleaning house. He is purging His church. How many of us will make it to the Promised Land after this purging?
Our assembly needs a MAJOR reorganization under completely new leadership. Our constitution needs some MAJOR ratifications. Let’s pray that the next wave of leaders are really and truly, in every sense of the phrase, Men of God.
Whatever we do, wherever we go, let us NEVER leave the Body of Christ. A major division is immanent in our organization. It saddens me that some will leave to other oneness organizations, some will form their own churches, and unfortunately, some will just leave the Lord’s path all together. Brothers and Sisters, let us hold steadfast to the hand of the Lord and NEVER take our eyes off of Him because His coming is at hand. REGARDLESS OF WHERE WE GO let us never lower our Christian standards that God has given us, continue in His path and go forward. The change that is to come for our beloved organization will be a painful one, but we will heal with His help. This needed to be done. It is all in His perfect plan.
"...no todo el que dijiere Senor. . . "
They say Yahweh is the God of the Desert, so I've come to the desert to look for him. I kneel on clean, soft, gray carpet, steadying my suddenly wobbly body by holding onto the pew in front of me. There is another force that keeps me from falling, a slightly trembling hand on my back, right between my shoulder blades. It is the hand of Brother Arturo of Guadalajara. An usher at the church, he's my spiritual sponsor this Sunday afternoon in this baked town about 30 miles east of Palm Springs, where aging Chicano gangsters, recently arrived immigrants and poor, hard-working people employed at local factories and in the desert fields live.
On the altar, a band plays a slow spiritual, an MTV-age hymn with just three chords repeated in an endless loop that sounds like a hypnotic rock jam of the late '60s--a wall of Christian sound. The pastor, Luciano Montes, is an amicable, paunchy thirtysomething. He stands at the pulpit, bellowing into the microphone, a baritone without much technical grace but who inspires through sheer enthusiasm.
There are some 1,000 Latino Protestant churches in the city of Los Angeles alone, the majority of which are evangelical. There are thousands more throughout the Southwest. Even within the Catholic Church, the Pentecostal influence is felt: The number of "charismatic" churches, congregations that want to remain within the Catholic flock but seek the kind of spiritual pyrotechnics of the evangelicals, is on the rise--and this movement is also powered, to a great extent, by Latinos.
To Primo
Primito you sound a little bit amargadito! You should go back to OJ! Where were you when everything got started there in Midland? You should research the history of the church there in Midland I am sure that would shut you up. Breifly FYI had it not been for the Torres family there probably wouldn't be any church in Midand. That family put their blood, sweat, tears, and money so that the AA could benefitingly have a church of the magnitude it has now! SO just Shut Up! Cuz.
LA DIST.
For those of you in Texas that think you are the only ones sick and tired of the incompetency of the GB. You are very wrong! Here in LA there is already something going on that will change things.
FYI another meeting has been scheduled this coming week. This time a well known pastor has been invited and has accepted! More to come,,,
Gracias por haber respondido a la invitacion a la Convencion de la Iglesia Apostolica de Mexico que
se dio acabo en el Westin Hotel Central Park en Dallas, Texas.
Habia como 200 miembros de la Asamblea Apostolica que respondieron a esta invitacion, y pudieron gozar ricamente con la predicacio de el Obispo Presidente, Felix Gaxiola y del Secretario General, Raul Murillo.
Los cantos, el servicio, las reuniones y el companerismo fue totalmente Apostolico. Tambien el servicio que se verifico el Sabado por la noche, dirigido por el Obispo del Districto de Los Angeles, Samuel Aguilar fue de mucha bendicion para todos.
Thanks to all of you who responded to the invitation from the Iglesia Apostolica de Mexico, to their Convention this weekend at the Westin Central Park Hotel in Dallas, Texas.
There were about 200 Pastors and members of the Apostolic Assembly who attended.
The services, the worship, the meetings and fellowship were wonderful. Everyone worshiped in freedom and were so friendly and receptive to all.
The sermons by the Presiding Bishop
Felix Gaxiola and General Secretary, Raul Murillo were excellent, and tonight (Saturday) the service directed by Bishop Samuel Aguilar of the Los Angeles District was truly a blessing.
Even the General Board came down and greeted everyone after service in a warm and friendly manner.
It was a great feeling to be among people who showed true christian love and went out of their way to greet one another.
It was like the good old times of the Apostolic Assembly, not like the Board we have now that after the service is over, they take of running and lock themselves up in their hotel room.
It was a refreshing experience to see true christian fellowship.
Worship Break...
"Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father."
He is risen! He is risen! He is risen!
He is risen as the Scriptures had said! The two disciples on Emmaus' road experienced the power of the Word for they later said that their hearts burned within when He spoke.
Steve Farrar writes: "I need to be reminded of what is true. God's Word gives me a dose of reality. My morning briefing in the Word gives me a perspective that I don't get in the world. I need God's commentary on my life every day. A Christian...in this society is swimming upstream. Without the constant nutrition of the Word, he will soon tire and be dragged off by the sheer force of the current."
So, let us spend time each day in the Scriptures!
Trophyman, yes I am from Ojinaga and proud of it, wouldn't you? Now I am not amargadito or anything like that I have been here in Midland Texas since we where in the small church almost from the beginning, and for your information I have been working and sweating as much as the next brother from cooking to nailing boards picking up trash sweeping you name it my wife and I have been here for a long time, we know what is going on and who ever you are tell me how and when we can talk person to person and I will show you with facts about things I am talking, I am not here to fight or argue about something I haven't went through. Brother.......
¡¡ATENCION PASTORES!!
La deshonorable mesa directiva se defiende en sus declaraciones del 21 de febrero, diciendo que el CID fue presentado para su aprobación a obispos y pastores.
Los que están deshonestamente en el mÃsmo nivel de moral que ellos (mesa directiva y comisión calificadora) y que los defienden, aluden a lo mÃsmo.
PERO NO IMPORTA que se trate del presidente, porque desde el presidente, hasta el pastor más humilde, TODOS DEBEN SUJETARSE A LA CONSTITUCION exactamente de la misma manera.
El presidente TENIA QUE haber pasado el CID por el proceso que marca el artÃculo 75 de nuestra constitución. El inciso I, dice: "Las propuestas-iniciativas, son el instrumento para enmendar, crear o eliminar artÃculos de la Constitución de la Asamblea Apostólica, y DEBERAN INICIALMENTE (énfasis agregado) entregarse al Obispo Secretario General quien, en su DEBIDO ORDEN (énfasis agregado), las presentarán a la reunión ministerial de la Convención General, para estudiar si deben recibir una resolución inicial de proceso".
NADA DE ESTO SE HIZO, quedando el CID como un documento QUE AÑADE conceptos al artÃculo 5 de nuestra constitución, inciso II, lo cual significa que el CID provoca una enmienda a la constitución, y crea nuevos conceptos que se añaden al mismo artÃculo 5, inciso II.
Esto obligaba a que el CID, TENIA QUE HABER PASADO POR EL ARTICULO 75, sin importar que el CID fuera creado por orden del presidente a MartÃn del Campo.
Por otro lado, ya que los deshonestos de la mesa directiva, y los deshonestos que los defienden, insisten en que fue aprobado por obispos y pastores. Pues bien, vamos a ver de forma precisa, QUE ES LO QUE SE APROBO. (haciendo de momento a un lado la realidad de que el CID NO ES constitucional de acuerdo al juez y al artÃculo 75).
Primero: De acuerdo a la declaración de Sánchez del 21 de febrero, él dice que le pidió a MartÃn del Campo, y a Eddie "el 2 votos", que interpretaran de manera clara las palabras capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho. También quedó escrito que le pidió a MartÃn del Campo que "DEFINIERA CLARAMENTE EL LENGUAJE DE LOS TERMINOS, capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho". ¡¡ATENCION!! Por eso, MartÃn del Campo NO INCLUYO VOTOS en su documento (digo su documento, porque en él no aparece el nombre de Eddie "el 2 votos"). Y
¡¡ATENCION!! Sánchez también le habÃa pedido previamente a Luciano Montes que hiciera lo mÃsmo, pero como Luciano Montes fue honesto INCLUYENDO LOS VOTOS EN EL DOCUMENTO, pues Sánchez ni caso le hizo al documento ORIGINAL del CID, porque ya tenÃa planeado IGNORAR LOS VOTOS DE LOS PASTORES. Y el CID que le hizo MartÃn del Campo ESE SI LE GUSTO porque se prestaba para cumplir la CONSPIRACION Y EL FRAUDE QUE YA TENIA PLANEADO JUNTO CON VALVERDE.
Segundo: El nefasto documento se hizo, lleno de AMBIGUEDADES, que se presta para usarlo como se les antoje. Y ¿Qué es lo que contiene entonces el CID? Respuesta: La interpretación personal de MartÃn del Campo de las palabras capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho, que es EXACTAMENTE Y UNICAMENTE lo que Sánchez le pidió.
Tercero: La interpretación de las palabras capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho, le fue presentada a los obispo y pastores.
Cuarto: Asà que, lo que los obispos y pastores APROBARON fue UNICAMENTE LA INTERPRETACION del lenguaje de las palabras, capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho; NADA MAS!!!
Quinto: Eso significa, que EL RESTO del contenido del artÃculo 5, inciso II, QUEDO INTACTO, VALIDO Y VIGENTE, Y POR LO TANTO LA COMISION CALIFICADORA LO DEBERIA DE HABER OBEDECIDO AL PIE DE LA LETRA en las Elecciones de Noviembre del 2006,
Es decir, que en PRIMER LUGAR, deberÃan de haber tomado en cuenta a los que obtuvieron EL MAYOR NUMERO DE VOTOS, pero ellos IGNORARON los votos de los pastores, y deberÃan de haber escogido de 2 a 5 de los que habÃan obtenido el mayor número de votos.
Pero, ¿Qué es lo que hizo la comisión calificadora? IGNORANDO los votos de los pastores, ellos empezaron a votar por cada uno de los nombres que les fueron enviados por los 5 de la comisión electoral que contaron los votos, y dicen en sus declaraciones del 21 de febrero.
Que NO FUE APROBADO NINGUNO QUE NO HUBIERE RECIBIDO DE ELLOS (mesa calificadora) EL MAYOR NUMERO DE VOTOS. AhÃ, en ese momento, desecharon a quienes ellos quisieron, y pusieron a quienes ellos ya habÃan planeado poner, tomando como excusa el nefasto CID, para cometer fraude, y consumar la conspiración planeada, la mentira, la hipocresÃa, actos ruines, sucios, anticristianos, de sucia polÃtica, asà como los impÃos del mundo.
Haciéndole gran daño a los pastores, que por Obra del EspÃritu Santo, a través de los pastores, habÃan quedado elegidos LEGITIMAMENTE!!!
Es esto HONESTO, y CRISTIANO? Yo no se cómo pueden festejar la decisión del juez, y decir que "fueron justificados" por el juez, y considerar su fallo como un triunfo.
DeberÃa de darles verguenza, pero eso serÃa ESPERAR MUCHO DE ELLOS Y DE LOS QUE LOS DEFIENDEN. Pero el Juez de jueces, condenatoriamente para ellos, NO LOS JUSTIFICA!!!
Pastores, ABRAN LOS OJOS, únanse a esta lucha que NO ha terminado. ¿Sabrá este juez la constitución mejor que los pastores? ¿Estará bien que le haya dado más valor a lo que NO está escrito que a lo que SI está escrito para tomar su decisión?
¿Que no se supone que todo lo que se hace se debe de hacer en APEGO escrito como marca la constitución? El presidente Sánchez violó el artÃculo 39, inciso I (entre otros), el cual dice: "El Obispo Presidente, al ser electo, para ser confirmado en su puesto, deberá protestar públicamente, a cumplir con todos los ordenamientos establecidos en la presente Constitución"...
El artÃculo 75 es un ordenamiento establecido para ENMENDAR o REFORMAR la constitución, y Sánchez lo violó. Y finalmente, él, Valverde, y resto de la comisión calificadora, VIOLARON LA CONFIANZA DE LOS OBIPOS Y PASTORES al DARLE EL USO AL CID,sin integridad ni temor de Dios, de una forma QUE NUNCA EXPLICARON A LOS OBISPOS Y PASTORES!!!
Constitucionalmente, el voto tomado a los obispos y pastores, NO TIENE NINGUNA VALIDEZ, por lo antes explicado, ya que el CID no pasó por el proceso constitucional
del artÃculo 75.
Y lo que especialmente hace que el CID se haya estado usando ilegalmente de acuerdo a nuestras leyes constitucionales, es la forma SIN INTEGRIDAD NI HONESTIDAD en que lo han usado.
Que NUNCA!! advirtieron que lo harÃan asi, como ahora nos hemos dado cuenta. Y eso porque fueron obligados por el juez, a fuerzas tenÃan que explicar el proceso que ellos siguieron, y ahora quedaron expuestos, y descubiertos ante ustedes los pastores.
Pastores, ABRAN LOS OJOS, hagan conciencia de lo que son capaces de hacer nuestros máximos lÃderes.
Unanse, la unión hace la fuerza, busquen, llamen por teléfono, contáctense con nuestros hermanos que hicieron posible que a la mesa directiva se le llame a cuentas.
La lucha no ha terminado, apenas comienza, sabemos que no ha sido fácil, pero con la ayuda de Dios y el apoyo de ustedes, SERA POSIBLE LA JUSTICIA!!!
¡¡ATENCION PASTORES!!
La deshonorable mesa directiva se defiende en sus declaraciones del 21 de febrero, diciendo que el CID fue presentado para su aprobación a obispos y pastores.
Los que están deshonestamente en el mÃsmo nivel de moral que ellos (mesa directiva y comisión calificadora) y que los defienden, aluden a lo mÃsmo.
PERO NO IMPORTA que se trate del presidente, porque desde el presidente, hasta el pastor más humilde, TODOS DEBEN SUJETARSE A LA CONSTITUCION exactamente de la misma manera.
El presidente TENIA QUE haber pasado el CID por el proceso que marca el artÃculo 75 de nuestra constitución. El inciso I, dice: "Las propuestas-iniciativas, son el instrumento para enmendar, crear o eliminar artÃculos de la Constitución de la Asamblea Apostólica, y DEBERAN INICIALMENTE (énfasis agregado) entregarse al Obispo Secretario General quien, en su DEBIDO ORDEN (énfasis agregado), las presentarán a la reunión ministerial de la Convención General, para estudiar si deben recibir una resolución inicial de proceso".
NADA DE ESTO SE HIZO, quedando el CID como un documento QUE AÑADE conceptos al artÃculo 5 de nuestra constitución, inciso II, lo cual significa que el CID provoca una enmienda a la constitución, y crea nuevos conceptos que se añaden al mismo artÃculo 5, inciso II.
Esto obligaba a que el CID, TENIA QUE HABER PASADO POR EL ARTICULO 75, sin importar que el CID fuera creado por orden del presidente a MartÃn del Campo.
Por otro lado, ya que los deshonestos de la mesa directiva, y los deshonestos que los defienden, insisten en que fue aprobado por obispos y pastores. Pues bien, vamos a ver de forma precisa, QUE ES LO QUE SE APROBO. (haciendo de momento a un lado la realidad de que el CID NO ES constitucional de acuerdo al juez y al artÃculo 75).
Primero: De acuerdo a la declaración de Sánchez del 21 de febrero, él dice que le pidió a MartÃn del Campo, y a Eddie "el 2 votos", que interpretaran de manera clara las palabras capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho. También quedó escrito que le pidió a MartÃn del Campo que "DEFINIERA CLARAMENTE EL LENGUAJE DE LOS TERMINOS, capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho". ¡¡ATENCION!! Por eso, MartÃn del Campo NO INCLUYO VOTOS en su documento (digo su documento, porque en él no aparece el nombre de Eddie "el 2 votos"). Y
¡¡ATENCION!! Sánchez también le habÃa pedido previamente a Luciano Montes que hiciera lo mÃsmo, pero como Luciano Montes fue honesto INCLUYENDO LOS VOTOS EN EL DOCUMENTO, pues Sánchez ni caso le hizo al documento ORIGINAL del CID, porque ya tenÃa planeado IGNORAR LOS VOTOS DE LOS PASTORES. Y el CID que le hizo MartÃn del Campo ESE SI LE GUSTO porque se prestaba para cumplir la CONSPIRACION Y EL FRAUDE QUE YA TENIA PLANEADO JUNTO CON VALVERDE.
Segundo: El nefasto documento se hizo, lleno de AMBIGUEDADES, que se presta para usarlo como se les antoje. Y ¿Qué es lo que contiene entonces el CID? Respuesta: La interpretación personal de MartÃn del Campo de las palabras capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho, que es EXACTAMENTE Y UNICAMENTE lo que Sánchez le pidió.
Tercero: La interpretación de las palabras capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho, le fue presentada a los obispo y pastores.
Cuarto: Asà que, lo que los obispos y pastores APROBARON fue UNICAMENTE LA INTERPRETACION del lenguaje de las palabras, capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho; NADA MAS!!!
Quinto: Eso significa, que EL RESTO del contenido del artÃculo 5, inciso II, QUEDO INTACTO, VALIDO Y VIGENTE, Y POR LO TANTO LA COMISION CALIFICADORA LO DEBERIA DE HABER OBEDECIDO AL PIE DE LA LETRA en las Elecciones de Noviembre del 2006,
Es decir, que en PRIMER LUGAR, deberÃan de haber tomado en cuenta a los que obtuvieron EL MAYOR NUMERO DE VOTOS, pero ellos IGNORARON los votos de los pastores, y deberÃan de haber escogido de 2 a 5 de los que habÃan obtenido el mayor número de votos.
Pero, ¿Qué es lo que hizo la comisión calificadora? IGNORANDO los votos de los pastores, ellos empezaron a votar por cada uno de los nombres que les fueron enviados por los 5 de la comisión electoral que contaron los votos, y dicen en sus declaraciones del 21 de febrero.
Que NO FUE APROBADO NINGUNO QUE NO HUBIERE RECIBIDO DE ELLOS (mesa calificadora) EL MAYOR NUMERO DE VOTOS. AhÃ, en ese momento, desecharon a quienes ellos quisieron, y pusieron a quienes ellos ya habÃan planeado poner, tomando como excusa el nefasto CID, para cometer fraude, y consumar la conspiración planeada, la mentira, la hipocresÃa, actos ruines, sucios, anticristianos, de sucia polÃtica, asà como los impÃos del mundo.
Haciéndole gran daño a los pastores, que por Obra del EspÃritu Santo, a través de los pastores, habÃan quedado elegidos LEGITIMAMENTE!!!
Es esto HONESTO, y CRISTIANO? Yo no se cómo pueden festejar la decisión del juez, y decir que "fueron justificados" por el juez, y considerar su fallo como un triunfo.
DeberÃa de darles verguenza, pero eso serÃa ESPERAR MUCHO DE ELLOS Y DE LOS QUE LOS DEFIENDEN. Pero el Juez de jueces, condenatoriamente para ellos, NO LOS JUSTIFICA!!!
Pastores, ABRAN LOS OJOS, únanse a esta lucha que NO ha terminado. ¿Sabrá este juez la constitución mejor que los pastores? ¿Estará bien que le haya dado más valor a lo que NO está escrito que a lo que SI está escrito para tomar su decisión?
¿Que no se supone que todo lo que se hace se debe de hacer en APEGO escrito como marca la constitución? El presidente Sánchez violó el artÃculo 39, inciso I (entre otros), el cual dice: "El Obispo Presidente, al ser electo, para ser confirmado en su puesto, deberá protestar públicamente, a cumplir con todos los ordenamientos establecidos en la presente Constitución"...
El artÃculo 75 es un ordenamiento establecido para ENMENDAR o REFORMAR la constitución, y Sánchez lo violó. Y finalmente, él, Valverde, y resto de la comisión calificadora, VIOLARON LA CONFIANZA DE LOS OBIPOS Y PASTORES al DARLE EL USO AL CID,sin integridad ni temor de Dios, de una forma QUE NUNCA EXPLICARON A LOS OBISPOS Y PASTORES!!!
Constitucionalmente, el voto tomado a los obispos y pastores, NO TIENE NINGUNA VALIDEZ, por lo antes explicado, ya que el CID no pasó por el proceso constitucional
del artÃculo 75.
Y lo que especialmente hace que el CID se haya estado usando ilegalmente de acuerdo a nuestras leyes constitucionales, es la forma SIN INTEGRIDAD NI HONESTIDAD en que lo han usado.
Que NUNCA!! advirtieron que lo harÃan asi, como ahora nos hemos dado cuenta. Y eso porque fueron obligados por el juez, a fuerzas tenÃan que explicar el proceso que ellos siguieron, y ahora quedaron expuestos, y descubiertos ante ustedes los pastores.
Pastores, ABRAN LOS OJOS, hagan conciencia de lo que son capaces de hacer nuestros máximos lÃderes.
Unanse, la unión hace la fuerza, busquen, llamen por teléfono, contáctense con nuestros hermanos que hicieron posible que a la mesa directiva se le llame a cuentas.
La lucha no ha terminado, apenas comienza, sabemos que no ha sido fácil, pero con la ayuda de Dios y el apoyo de ustedes, SERA POSIBLE LA JUSTICIA!!!
¡¡ATENCION PASTORES!!
La deshonorable mesa directiva se defiende en sus declaraciones del 21 de febrero, diciendo que el CID fue presentado para su aprobación a obispos y pastores.
Los que están deshonestamente en el mÃsmo nivel de moral que ellos (mesa directiva y comisión calificadora) y que los defienden, aluden a lo mÃsmo.
PERO NO IMPORTA que se trate del presidente, porque desde el presidente, hasta el pastor más humilde, TODOS DEBEN SUJETARSE A LA CONSTITUCION exactamente de la misma manera.
El presidente TENIA QUE haber pasado el CID por el proceso que marca el artÃculo 75 de nuestra constitución. El inciso I, dice: "Las propuestas-iniciativas, son el instrumento para enmendar, crear o eliminar artÃculos de la Constitución de la Asamblea Apostólica, y DEBERAN INICIALMENTE (énfasis agregado) entregarse al Obispo Secretario General quien, en su DEBIDO ORDEN (énfasis agregado), las presentarán a la reunión ministerial de la Convención General, para estudiar si deben recibir una resolución inicial de proceso".
NADA DE ESTO SE HIZO, quedando el CID como un documento QUE AÑADE conceptos al artÃculo 5 de nuestra constitución, inciso II, lo cual significa que el CID provoca una enmienda a la constitución, y crea nuevos conceptos que se añaden al mismo artÃculo 5, inciso II.
Esto obligaba a que el CID, TENIA QUE HABER PASADO POR EL ARTICULO 75, sin importar que el CID fuera creado por orden del presidente a MartÃn del Campo.
Por otro lado, ya que los deshonestos de la mesa directiva, y los deshonestos que los defienden, insisten en que fue aprobado por obispos y pastores. Pues bien, vamos a ver de forma precisa, QUE ES LO QUE SE APROBO. (haciendo de momento a un lado la realidad de que el CID NO ES constitucional de acuerdo al juez y al artÃculo 75).
Primero: De acuerdo a la declaración de Sánchez del 21 de febrero, él dice que le pidió a MartÃn del Campo, y a Eddie "el 2 votos", que interpretaran de manera clara las palabras capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho. También quedó escrito que le pidió a MartÃn del Campo que "DEFINIERA CLARAMENTE EL LENGUAJE DE LOS TERMINOS, capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho". ¡¡ATENCION!! Por eso, MartÃn del Campo NO INCLUYO VOTOS en su documento (digo su documento, porque en él no aparece el nombre de Eddie "el 2 votos"). Y
¡¡ATENCION!! Sánchez también le habÃa pedido previamente a Luciano Montes que hiciera lo mÃsmo, pero como Luciano Montes fue honesto INCLUYENDO LOS VOTOS EN EL DOCUMENTO, pues Sánchez ni caso le hizo al documento ORIGINAL del CID, porque ya tenÃa planeado IGNORAR LOS VOTOS DE LOS PASTORES. Y el CID que le hizo MartÃn del Campo ESE SI LE GUSTO porque se prestaba para cumplir la CONSPIRACION Y EL FRAUDE QUE YA TENIA PLANEADO JUNTO CON VALVERDE.
Segundo: El nefasto documento se hizo, lleno de AMBIGUEDADES, que se presta para usarlo como se les antoje. Y ¿Qué es lo que contiene entonces el CID? Respuesta: La interpretación personal de MartÃn del Campo de las palabras capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho, que es EXACTAMENTE Y UNICAMENTE lo que Sánchez le pidió.
Tercero: La interpretación de las palabras capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho, le fue presentada a los obispo y pastores.
Cuarto: Asà que, lo que los obispos y pastores APROBARON fue UNICAMENTE LA INTERPRETACION del lenguaje de las palabras, capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho; NADA MAS!!!
Quinto: Eso significa, que EL RESTO del contenido del artÃculo 5, inciso II, QUEDO INTACTO, VALIDO Y VIGENTE, Y POR LO TANTO LA COMISION CALIFICADORA LO DEBERIA DE HABER OBEDECIDO AL PIE DE LA LETRA en las Elecciones de Noviembre del 2006,
Es decir, que en PRIMER LUGAR, deberÃan de haber tomado en cuenta a los que obtuvieron EL MAYOR NUMERO DE VOTOS, pero ellos IGNORARON los votos de los pastores, y deberÃan de haber escogido de 2 a 5 de los que habÃan obtenido el mayor número de votos.
Pero, ¿Qué es lo que hizo la comisión calificadora? IGNORANDO los votos de los pastores, ellos empezaron a votar por cada uno de los nombres que les fueron enviados por los 5 de la comisión electoral que contaron los votos, y dicen en sus declaraciones del 21 de febrero.
Que NO FUE APROBADO NINGUNO QUE NO HUBIERE RECIBIDO DE ELLOS (mesa calificadora) EL MAYOR NUMERO DE VOTOS. AhÃ, en ese momento, desecharon a quienes ellos quisieron, y pusieron a quienes ellos ya habÃan planeado poner, tomando como excusa el nefasto CID, para cometer fraude, y consumar la conspiración planeada, la mentira, la hipocresÃa, actos ruines, sucios, anticristianos, de sucia polÃtica, asà como los impÃos del mundo.
Haciéndole gran daño a los pastores, que por Obra del EspÃritu Santo, a través de los pastores, habÃan quedado elegidos LEGITIMAMENTE!!!
Es esto HONESTO, y CRISTIANO? Yo no se cómo pueden festejar la decisión del juez, y decir que "fueron justificados" por el juez, y considerar su fallo como un triunfo.
DeberÃa de darles verguenza, pero eso serÃa ESPERAR MUCHO DE ELLOS Y DE LOS QUE LOS DEFIENDEN. Pero el Juez de jueces, condenatoriamente para ellos, NO LOS JUSTIFICA!!!
Pastores, ABRAN LOS OJOS, únanse a esta lucha que NO ha terminado. ¿Sabrá este juez la constitución mejor que los pastores? ¿Estará bien que le haya dado más valor a lo que NO está escrito que a lo que SI está escrito para tomar su decisión?
¿Que no se supone que todo lo que se hace se debe de hacer en APEGO escrito como marca la constitución? El presidente Sánchez violó el artÃculo 39, inciso I (entre otros), el cual dice: "El Obispo Presidente, al ser electo, para ser confirmado en su puesto, deberá protestar públicamente, a cumplir con todos los ordenamientos establecidos en la presente Constitución"...
El artÃculo 75 es un ordenamiento establecido para ENMENDAR o REFORMAR la constitución, y Sánchez lo violó. Y finalmente, él, Valverde, y resto de la comisión calificadora, VIOLARON LA CONFIANZA DE LOS OBIPOS Y PASTORES al DARLE EL USO AL CID,sin integridad ni temor de Dios, de una forma QUE NUNCA EXPLICARON A LOS OBISPOS Y PASTORES!!!
Constitucionalmente, el voto tomado a los obispos y pastores, NO TIENE NINGUNA VALIDEZ, por lo antes explicado, ya que el CID no pasó por el proceso constitucional
del artÃculo 75.
Y lo que especialmente hace que el CID se haya estado usando ilegalmente de acuerdo a nuestras leyes constitucionales, es la forma SIN INTEGRIDAD NI HONESTIDAD en que lo han usado.
Que NUNCA!! advirtieron que lo harÃan asi, como ahora nos hemos dado cuenta. Y eso porque fueron obligados por el juez, a fuerzas tenÃan que explicar el proceso que ellos siguieron, y ahora quedaron expuestos, y descubiertos ante ustedes los pastores.
Pastores, ABRAN LOS OJOS, hagan conciencia de lo que son capaces de hacer nuestros máximos lÃderes.
Unanse, la unión hace la fuerza, busquen, llamen por teléfono, contáctense con nuestros hermanos que hicieron posible que a la mesa directiva se le llame a cuentas.
La lucha no ha terminado, apenas comienza, sabemos que no ha sido fácil, pero con la ayuda de Dios y el apoyo de ustedes, SERA POSIBLE LA JUSTICIA!!!
¡¡ATENCION PASTORES!!
La deshonorable mesa directiva se defiende en sus declaraciones del 21 de febrero, diciendo que el CID fue presentado para su aprobación a obispos y pastores.
Los que están deshonestamente en el mÃsmo nivel de moral que ellos (mesa directiva y comisión calificadora) y que los defienden, aluden a lo mÃsmo.
PERO NO IMPORTA que se trate del presidente, porque desde el presidente, hasta el pastor más humilde, TODOS DEBEN SUJETARSE A LA CONSTITUCION exactamente de la misma manera.
El presidente TENIA QUE haber pasado el CID por el proceso que marca el artÃculo 75 de nuestra constitución. El inciso I, dice: "Las propuestas-iniciativas, son el instrumento para enmendar, crear o eliminar artÃculos de la Constitución de la Asamblea Apostólica, y DEBERAN INICIALMENTE (énfasis agregado) entregarse al Obispo Secretario General quien, en su DEBIDO ORDEN (énfasis agregado), las presentarán a la reunión ministerial de la Convención General, para estudiar si deben recibir una resolución inicial de proceso".
NADA DE ESTO SE HIZO, quedando el CID como un documento QUE AÑADE conceptos al artÃculo 5 de nuestra constitución, inciso II, lo cual significa que el CID provoca una enmienda a la constitución, y crea nuevos conceptos que se añaden al mismo artÃculo 5, inciso II.
Esto obligaba a que el CID, TENIA QUE HABER PASADO POR EL ARTICULO 75, sin importar que el CID fuera creado por orden del presidente a MartÃn del Campo.
Por otro lado, ya que los deshonestos de la mesa directiva, y los deshonestos que los defienden, insisten en que fue aprobado por obispos y pastores. Pues bien, vamos a ver de forma precisa, QUE ES LO QUE SE APROBO. (haciendo de momento a un lado la realidad de que el CID NO ES constitucional de acuerdo al juez y al artÃculo 75).
Primero: De acuerdo a la declaración de Sánchez del 21 de febrero, él dice que le pidió a MartÃn del Campo, y a Eddie "el 2 votos", que interpretaran de manera clara las palabras capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho. También quedó escrito que le pidió a MartÃn del Campo que "DEFINIERA CLARAMENTE EL LENGUAJE DE LOS TERMINOS, capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho". ¡¡ATENCION!! Por eso, MartÃn del Campo NO INCLUYO VOTOS en su documento (digo su documento, porque en él no aparece el nombre de Eddie "el 2 votos"). Y
¡¡ATENCION!! Sánchez también le habÃa pedido previamente a Luciano Montes que hiciera lo mÃsmo, pero como Luciano Montes fue honesto INCLUYENDO LOS VOTOS EN EL DOCUMENTO, pues Sánchez ni caso le hizo al documento ORIGINAL del CID, porque ya tenÃa planeado IGNORAR LOS VOTOS DE LOS PASTORES. Y el CID que le hizo MartÃn del Campo ESE SI LE GUSTO porque se prestaba para cumplir la CONSPIRACION Y EL FRAUDE QUE YA TENIA PLANEADO JUNTO CON VALVERDE.
Segundo: El nefasto documento se hizo, lleno de AMBIGUEDADES, que se presta para usarlo como se les antoje. Y ¿Qué es lo que contiene entonces el CID? Respuesta: La interpretación personal de MartÃn del Campo de las palabras capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho, que es EXACTAMENTE Y UNICAMENTE lo que Sánchez le pidió.
Tercero: La interpretación de las palabras capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho, le fue presentada a los obispo y pastores.
Cuarto: Asà que, lo que los obispos y pastores APROBARON fue UNICAMENTE LA INTERPRETACION del lenguaje de las palabras, capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho; NADA MAS!!!
Quinto: Eso significa, que EL RESTO del contenido del artÃculo 5, inciso II, QUEDO INTACTO, VALIDO Y VIGENTE, Y POR LO TANTO LA COMISION CALIFICADORA LO DEBERIA DE HABER OBEDECIDO AL PIE DE LA LETRA en las Elecciones de Noviembre del 2006,
Es decir, que en PRIMER LUGAR, deberÃan de haber tomado en cuenta a los que obtuvieron EL MAYOR NUMERO DE VOTOS, pero ellos IGNORARON los votos de los pastores, y deberÃan de haber escogido de 2 a 5 de los que habÃan obtenido el mayor número de votos.
Pero, ¿Qué es lo que hizo la comisión calificadora? IGNORANDO los votos de los pastores, ellos empezaron a votar por cada uno de los nombres que les fueron enviados por los 5 de la comisión electoral que contaron los votos, y dicen en sus declaraciones del 21 de febrero.
Que NO FUE APROBADO NINGUNO QUE NO HUBIERE RECIBIDO DE ELLOS (mesa calificadora) EL MAYOR NUMERO DE VOTOS. AhÃ, en ese momento, desecharon a quienes ellos quisieron, y pusieron a quienes ellos ya habÃan planeado poner, tomando como excusa el nefasto CID, para cometer fraude, y consumar la conspiración planeada, la mentira, la hipocresÃa, actos ruines, sucios, anticristianos, de sucia polÃtica, asà como los impÃos del mundo.
Haciéndole gran daño a los pastores, que por Obra del EspÃritu Santo, a través de los pastores, habÃan quedado elegidos LEGITIMAMENTE!!!
Es esto HONESTO, y CRISTIANO? Yo no se cómo pueden festejar la decisión del juez, y decir que "fueron justificados" por el juez, y considerar su fallo como un triunfo.
DeberÃa de darles verguenza, pero eso serÃa ESPERAR MUCHO DE ELLOS Y DE LOS QUE LOS DEFIENDEN. Pero el Juez de jueces, condenatoriamente para ellos, NO LOS JUSTIFICA!!!
Pastores, ABRAN LOS OJOS, únanse a esta lucha que NO ha terminado. ¿Sabrá este juez la constitución mejor que los pastores? ¿Estará bien que le haya dado más valor a lo que NO está escrito que a lo que SI está escrito para tomar su decisión?
¿Que no se supone que todo lo que se hace se debe de hacer en APEGO escrito como marca la constitución? El presidente Sánchez violó el artÃculo 39, inciso I (entre otros), el cual dice: "El Obispo Presidente, al ser electo, para ser confirmado en su puesto, deberá protestar públicamente, a cumplir con todos los ordenamientos establecidos en la presente Constitución"...
El artÃculo 75 es un ordenamiento establecido para ENMENDAR o REFORMAR la constitución, y Sánchez lo violó. Y finalmente, él, Valverde, y resto de la comisión calificadora, VIOLARON LA CONFIANZA DE LOS OBIPOS Y PASTORES al DARLE EL USO AL CID,sin integridad ni temor de Dios, de una forma QUE NUNCA EXPLICARON A LOS OBISPOS Y PASTORES!!!
Constitucionalmente, el voto tomado a los obispos y pastores, NO TIENE NINGUNA VALIDEZ, por lo antes explicado, ya que el CID no pasó por el proceso constitucional
del artÃculo 75.
Y lo que especialmente hace que el CID se haya estado usando ilegalmente de acuerdo a nuestras leyes constitucionales, es la forma SIN INTEGRIDAD NI HONESTIDAD en que lo han usado.
Que NUNCA!! advirtieron que lo harÃan asi, como ahora nos hemos dado cuenta. Y eso porque fueron obligados por el juez, a fuerzas tenÃan que explicar el proceso que ellos siguieron, y ahora quedaron expuestos, y descubiertos ante ustedes los pastores.
Pastores, ABRAN LOS OJOS, hagan conciencia de lo que son capaces de hacer nuestros máximos lÃderes.
Unanse, la unión hace la fuerza, busquen, llamen por teléfono, contáctense con nuestros hermanos que hicieron posible que a la mesa directiva se le llame a cuentas.
La lucha no ha terminado, apenas comienza, sabemos que no ha sido fácil, pero con la ayuda de Dios y el apoyo de ustedes, SERA POSIBLE LA JUSTICIA!!!
Attention Pastors and Families Meeting in Secret:
You have been meeting in secret. Plotting a move from the AA.
If you want your move to be successful, then you should open up your meeting to the public at some point. The people must have their input since you will be asking for our support at some time.
Also, having secret meetings is no different from the way the AA does business.
And it came to pass a long time after that the Lord had given rest unto Israel from all their enemies roun about, that Joshua waxed old and stricken in age. And Joshua called for all Israel, and for their elders, and for their heads, and for their judges, and for their officers, and said unto them, I am old and stricken in age:
And ye have seen all that the Lord your God hath done unto all these nations because of you; for the Lord your God is he that hath fought for you.
Behold, I have divided unot you by lot these nations that remain, to be an inheritance for your tribes, from Jordan, with all the nations that i have cut off, even unto the great sea westward.
And the Lord your God, he shall expel them from before you, and drive them from out of your sight; and ye shall possess their land, as the Lord your God hath promised unto you.
Be ye there fore very courageous to keep and to do all that is written in the book of the law of Moses, that ye turn not aside therefrom to the right hand or to the left;
That ye come not among these nations, these that remain among you; neither make mention of the name of their gods, nor cause to swear by them, neither serve them, nor bow yourselves unto them:
But cleave unto the Lord your God, as ye have done unto this day.
For the Lord hath driven out from before you great nations and strong: but as for you, no man hath been able to stand before you unto this day.
One man of you shall chase a thousand: for the Lord your God, he it is that fighteth for you, as he hath promised you.
Take good heed therefore, unto yourselves, that ye love the Lord your God.
Else if ye do in any wise go back, and cleave unto the remnant of these nations, even these shtat remain among you, and shall make marriages with them and go in unto them and they to you:
Know for a certainty that the Lord your God will no more drive out any of these nations from before you; but they shall be snares and traps unto you; and scourges in your sides, and thorns in your eyes, until ye perish from this good land which the Lord your God hath given you.
And behold , this day I am going the way of all the earth: and ye know in all your hearts and in all your souls, that not one thing hath failed of all the good things which the Lord your God spake concerning you; all are come to pass unto you, and not one thing hath failed thereof.
Therefore it shall come to pass, that as all good things are come upon you, which the Lord you God promised you; so shall the Lord bring upon you all evil things, until he have destroyed you from off this good land which the Lord your God hath given you.
When ye have transgressed the covenant of the Lord your God, which he commanded you, and have gone and served other gods, and bowed yourselves to them; then shall the anger of the Lord be kindled against you;, and ye shall perish quickly from off the good land which he hath given you.
Shadows: Hows about some commentary so us sinners can know what your point is.
Don't get me wrong, I appreciate the scripture, but what are YOU trying to say?
Don't make me get Sam, John316 and CBG into this.....
ON A MORE POSITIVE NOTE: THE IGLESIA APOSTOLICA DID CELEBRATE THEIR NATIONAL CONVENTION AT DALLAS, TX, THIS PAST WK END ON THE 21, 22, &23RD OF MARCH. THE ACTIVITY WAS A 100% SUCCESS . THE SERMONS WERE AWESOME, AND SO WERE THE SONGS THAT WERE SUNG. HNA. ESTELLA CANTU WAS A GUEST AND SHE SANG SOME SONGS THAT HER DAD WROTE. THE LORDS PRESENCE FILLED THE PLACE.
HNOS. DE LA IGLESIA APOSTOLICA LES DESEO BENDICIONES, CON EL SISTEMA DE LAS REDES CELLULARES. YA SE ESTA VIENDO EL CECIMIENTO CON ESTE SISTEMA DE TRABAJO. Y SABEMOS QUE LA IGLESIA DE MEXICO ESTA CRECIENTO A PASOS AGIGANTADOS EN ESTE PAIS.
UNA COSA DE QUE ADMIRARSE, LOS LIDERES DE LA IGLESIA APOSTOLICA SALUDAN A TODA LA GENTE, SON TAN EDUCADOS, PERO A LA MISMA VEZ NO SE ELEVAN AL LUGAR QUE NO PUEDEN SALUDAR A LOS MIEMBROS PORQUE NO TIENEN TIEMPO. ME GOZE SALUDANTO A TODOS LOS HERMANOS INCLUYENDO AL HNO. RAUL MURILLO, FELIX GAXIOLA, JOEL MIRELES, ADAN MARTINEZ, HUMBERTO VILLALOBOS. TANTO HNO. TAN AMABLES Y LLENOS DE DIOS, DIOS LES GUARDE Y LOS BENDIGA MUCHO.
DIOS LES BENDIGA Y QUE SEAN DE BENDICION PARA ESTE PAIS.
apostolic blood tienes el E-Mail de Estela Cantu se cree que ella sabe de como Sanchez le quito una casa a la familia Romero cuando era pastor en Anaheim en 1987 y ahora la demolió y se esta haciendo una nueva los pobres huérfanos (Magdalena Raquel y Danny )quedaron en la calle. Pudiera verificar con ella si esto es cierto?
What we need is for someone to save us. To help us through this tough situation...
Check this out. Do you think we can recruit this person's help?
http://youtube.com/watch?v=AIiMa2Fe-ZQ
My answer to Van and to others who leave commentaries on this blog and with all due respect is that most of us have lost sight about what this blog is supposed to be about. That said, I believe the main word in the scripture that was entered for this purpose would be CLEAVE. Using this illustration maybe we can by this understand where we all stand in the situation that is going on in the assembly.
The abalone is considered a mollusk, and they attach themselves to coastal rocks underwater. It is said that the best way to get them of the rock that it is best to sneak up on them using a form of spatula or pry bar. It will be easier to remove if the element of surprise is used. When it perceives danger it cleaves tightly to the rocks. It almost went extinct.
We must understand that what we are going through in the assembly is not a physical or secular battle, although many see it in that light, but a spiritual battle in which the enemy has caught the majority of us off guard, the enemy having used the element of surprise and instead of cleaving to the ROCK (Jesus), we are slowly being pried off the ROCK. Let us not lose sight that we must be spiritual people.
Not all pastors in our assembly are possessed of greed, lying and deception. Many have a great fear of the Lord and waiting upon his return. The majority of us are hurting because of what is going on
and we need to pray for one another and at the same time pray for those who could be living in sin. Lets not forget the phrase "what goes around, comes around." I think that this blog site needs to be vetted so that there could be better understanding of whats going on, instead of having those that show they don't have much fear of God by they way they express themselves or who they are judging, therefore giving false testimony of who we Apostolics really are. If there are pastors who view this site, don't be afraid to lay down sound spiritual counsel using the Word , so that we can all win. Let us CLEAVE to the ROCK of our salvation.
Shadows, now thats better. Thank you for explaining. I agree, we should get refocused and begin to plan for the next round of elections by setting up a strategy to lobby, get votes and win.
There are those planning an exit strategy, good luck. Lets not over spiritualize this process. Though there should be spiritualness to this process, we have to deal with this world. Afterall, all you spiritual people got us into this mess when you didn't discearn what was going on in the first place.
Elections can be a dirty business. And with fellows like Pacheco, Valverde, Sanchez and Maffey, it will get dirty. We are dealing with men that have no compassion and no regard for the rule of law and the rule of the Word.
If Sanchez doesn't wink an eye when he disowned his own daughter and grandchildren, and son in law, then what makes you think he's gonna heed our petition?
If Valverde took advantage of an old, grieving man, when he got that land in Fontana, then what makes you think he'll be gracious.
Pacheco didn't wink an eye when he participated in that criminal conspiracy when he scammed all those hermanos.
Nope, the next round of elections need to be ALL or NOTHING.
Shadows, again, thank you for that explanation on Cleave. A sinner like myself was thinking Cleaveage. Thats probably because I was watching that Obama Girl video.
Peace out!
Recompense to no man evil for evil. Provide, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men. Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord. Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on hi head. Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good.
Ro. 12: 17-21
Shadows: Some interpretation please. Its nice to read the verse, but whats the message YOU are trying to convey?
TO HELLO...
NO SORRY I DONT HAVE HER EMAIL ADDRESS OR ANYTHING. IN FACT I HAD NEVER SEEN HER TILL THERE AT THAT CONVENTION, BUT SHE STATED THAT SHE LIVES IN SOUTH TEXAS NOW. MAYBE SOMEONE FROM THAT AREA KNOWS WHERE SHE IS AT. SORRY I COULDNT BE OF MORE HELP.
The Apostolic Church of Mexico (Iglesia de Mexico) is doing a real good Job or promoting their church to the Assembly
They always have something to prove to the Assembly, I know the Assembly is not in a great condition but the The church of Mexico is no better. They have had their share of injustices and fraud in their elections. They just accept it with more ease because of the Mexican culture of Politics.
Yeah, everyone wants to blame Bishop Baldemar Rodriguez for the split between the two churches or better yet for the disfellowship...
But if my memory serves me right, the Apostolic Church of Mexico is the one who started to violate the truce between the two churches.
The reason they are having so much success is two fold: First their culture is more inclined to work hard and evangelize.
Second, many disgruntled members from the Assembly are leaving and joining their ranks.
Iglesia Apostolica de Mexico, no se creen y no se almiren de la Asamblea. Los mismos problemas que tiene la Asamblea las tiene tambien la Iglesia, no mas que no se ha descubierto!
I have the documents to prove it!
The Insider:
Wrong Estella. If you are referring to the one who was involved in LenchoGate.
As in Lencho Salazar.
Oh, wasn't Baldemar the beneficiary of that one? How sad, the AA kicked Lorezo Salazar to the curb for getting his plumbing cleaned but promoted Edward Pacheco after he SCAMMED all those hermanos in a CRIMINAL CONSPIRACY.
I am looking at the convention pictures and the whole time I am thinking, "They knew what they were doing...they kept the Pastors there for over 6 hrs. but they already knew the outcome.
Bishop Valverde eliminated Bishop Fortino and Bishop Soloman because they were threats to the Presidency!
Wow these are the Men of God we follow!
Come on people let’s not bash the dead now. I cannot believe that anyone would bring this up. You have really struck a nerve here.
Bro. Lorenzo E. Salazar was a great man not only in my eyes but I would bet in the eyes of many. And I don’t care what is alleged or known to have happened to tarnish his good image. From all that we have heard now of all the envy, greed and altogether dishonest people who rise to power in our ranks I am most assured that Bro. Salazar was more likely than not set up to fall.
I still have always believed in Bro. Salazar and also believe in my heart he will always remain in the history of the church as the “Peoples President”. He is the only president that I know of to date who traveled the states visiting all congregations, not just go around picking up ofrendas at the so-called mega churches. He was such a blessing and we were so honored to know him. He didn’t just visit with the bishop’s or pastor’s and their families he was personable to “el mas humilde de mis pequenitos”. If he saw you at convention he was always sure to remember you and speak to you. You would always see him at convention mingling among the hermanos. He was just like us.
Bro. Salazar actually put in hard labor in our missionary fields, as opposed to “vacationing to the missions“. He wrote many inspirational songs that we still sing today. I can still hear his wonderful voice in song. We loved and respected Bro. Salazar.
To the memory of Bro. Lorenzo E. Salazar and may he rest in the Lord. Please allow him rest in peace.
Findings: This Court finds it has jurisdiction
14 to consider this matter under Civil Code Section 9418 inasmuch
15 as resolution of the claim does not require examination of the
16 content of the CID or any other ecclesiastical documents. Nor
17 does it involve interpreting religious doctrine or becoming
18 excessively entangled with religion.It seems equally plain to this Court that the
19 CID was not incorporated into the Constitution by way of an
20 amendment.Additionally, it is fairly clear that the Protesters have made
2 their claims amply known to defendants but have been rebuffed
3 in their efforts THE COURT: My tentative stands, counsel.
Counsel, I try to make it clear as to the basis
27 of my decisions so that when you take it up, at least the
28 Court of Appeal knows what the basis of my decision was
BEN T. KAYASHIMA, PRESIDING JUDGE
VAN.
Did I hit a nerve? Did I say it was L.S.? NO. I just asked if it was the Cantu and was involved with an ex pres.
By the way, if he got a piece that it between him and her.
I do agree he was the people's president.
Van:
I agree with you about Lorenzo Salazar, he was the People’s President.
But it seems like ‘the insider’ is implying that the woman also got together with an ex-president.
Are you trying to say that Baldemar benefited by keeping the woman? And does this mean there are other women?
Alert finally the GB found a solution for the AA dilemma.
Watch www.youtube.com/watch?v=2jrkwt_8DN8&feature=related
so like the Texas Regional Confference was so Awsome the Lord moved in a mighty way it was so powerful PRaise God for that!
Lorenzo Salazar was a good guy. Did he have his weakness? Sure. Did he "fall"? Yes. Do we have our weaknesses? Yes. Do we "Fall"? Yes.
I would venture to say that the sin of Lorenzo Salazar didn't hurt as many people as did the sins of Greed, deception and thievery of Edward Pacheco.
Valverde likes to give a "clean and clendestine" public image. But look who he associates with and has as a cohort on the general board, the Crook Edward Pacheco.
Bring Back Vizcara!
TO: Van & Apostolicanalyst
I am not blaming LS for his weekness. It's ture WE all have weekness.
Some admit it and other hide it.
LS RIP.
RE: LS
I'm not knocking the man. He was a good man but got taken out by scandal.
If you play in the big leagues, you have a big target on your back.
The Game is the Game.
This is ridiculous that people would come on a website and slander men of God like this...
lordhavemercy....
Are we slandering or just telling the true?
Its not slander, if its the TRUTH.
Van,
I was told by a very reliable source that LS met S. Cantu when he returned from serving in WWII and went to Texas to a regional convention. She was 7 years old at the time. He was in his early twenties.
He taught her many songs during the convention. She couldn’t read in Spanish, but she memorized them quickly. He accompanied her at the piano.
Years later, when she came to California with her parents and he was in Tulsa Oklahoma studying, he would still play for her when he came to Calif to visit his family. That was the extent of their friendship. Her singing, him playing.
Later on, when she was having problems with her marriage, he encouraged her to get out of the marriage and pursue the academic arena as she already had a B.A. from Cal State L.A. That qualified her to attend Fuller Seminary, where he was also studying. He never got to see her graduate as he passed away before she completed her degree. They were friends to the end.
She was also very close to many contemporaries of her youth, including D. Jauhall, who used to call her 'his little sister.'
Because of who her father was, there were many people she was very close to because of the nature of the work. I hear that many of them still keep in touch with her.
Those who were her true friends defended her against the retaliation by others.
However, I see that some are still attacking a person, who by my calculations, must be in her late 60's.
I remember she had her parent's passion for working with new immigrants. She also worked in the secular arena with the INS.
If anyone knows her address, I would like to write and encourage her to keep working for the Lord with those who are the ‘least of these.’
An 20 year old had a thing for a 7 year old? Went to convention and taught her songs?
I know there is something missing here.
That sounds, as we say in the hood, like a Marcelino.
Anyways, I remiss. The Stella, whom was the LS flame had a name that started with a "J" and ended with "enez".
I don't know if her maiden was Cantu. I walk gingerly when mentioning her name because her daughter is a lawyer, a grad from USC Law School.
WOW
It's quiet in here today.
Is everyone actually getting some work done for quarter end ? LOL
How ya doing CBG ?
Hope all is well my brother.
I see I'm missed! Can't carry a conversation with out the supreame input of my awesome intellectual input.
ITS OVER!!
sammy, sammy, sammy...
we were hoping that you had moved on and never to return to the land of the secularist and unspiritual bloggers here
it is not over until it is over... the fat lady has yet to sing!
"Thieves are jelous of each other's loot,
but the godly are well rooted and bear their OWN fruit"
Proverbs 12:12 (NLT)
jajemo
That fat lady not only sang, she cut her own cd. But I refuse to talk about Mrs. Baldemar on this thread.
The Dorcas are the fat ladies, and they sing every sunday. In unison!
I see the "Generetic Apostolic is back Sam)! Generic because he sounds and looks like a Christian but it's not the real thing! Dumb ...ss!
CBG, I knew you didn't have the guts to approach me. And now, well, I guess you can admit, you missed me.
"Yes, just as you can identify a tree by its FRUIT, so you can identify people by their ACTIONS."
Matthew 7:20 (NLT)
"Birds of a feather, still together"
Sam 03/28/2008
Re: "2 Vote Eddie"
Wasn't his church going to be finished by March 2008?
Every leader should read and those who seek leadership position, should be required to read
"Spiritual Authority" by Wathcman Nee
ISBN-10: 0935008357
ISBN-13: 978-0935008357
jajemo
jajemo
I already read it, thanks for the info though.
Watchman Nee? LOL Why should we be required to read that stuff. Thats all from Communist China. All that Asiatic voo doo budhah rooted dogma.
We need to learn more TD Jakes, more Marcos Witt, more Creflo Dollar, more Rick Warren. American theology.
USA All The Way!
Sam,
I dont mean to attack you but your comments are totally out of wack.
Their is no such thing as American Theology.
Its funny though because the man you support Bro. Sam Valverde, has a series on Spiritual Authority, do you know where he got his info?
Watchman Nee, just listen to the tapes and read the book. Amazing how they both say the same thing.
Bishop Valverde has done his own research all on his own. He learned it all by himself. Bishop Valverde is self taught and stands by his work.
There is word that the GB is divided amongst themselves.
During the Episcopal meeting a few days ago, they couldnt agree on what to tell the Bishops.
President Sanchez called their lawyer and their lawyer informed them that they should do nothing to the plantiffs until the appeal has passed.
What they are really worried about is that Bishop Torres presented several proposals to the Pastors at the last convention...
One of them was to limit the amount of years they could serve on the GB (20 yrs). It received overwhelming support from the Pastors.
If voted upon next year and if it passes, then most of them would be out.
The idea is to oust Bishop Torres before he can present it again at the next convention. But Good luck with that one.
Sam,
I am going to take a guess and say that overall you are a good guy but since you are anonymous it allows to make crazy comments, I think we all do that.
But lets be serious if you have ever studied at any level with the mindset of a student of the bible and a teacher of others you will know that all knowledge is based upon someone else's knowledge.
No matter what you learn or read, they learned it from somewhere and later used it.
No shame in that, just the truth.
Fabian, your just jelous cause Bishop Valverde sells the most cds and dvds and has written more books than any apostolic preacher in the history of the apostolic assembly. Jelous because he is invited to preach too all those conventions and conferences around the whole wide world. Bishop Valverde could start his own movement without breaking a sweet. You should read some of his preachings. He teaches like very excellent and the whole apostolic assembly church should thank God every day for giving is Bishop Valverde.
Sam,
I have heard his preachings. And till this day, he is one of my favorite preachers.
I think he has a gift from God to preach but I was just making the point that he uses books to preach from. Is there anything wrong with that?
Jealous? Why? Whatever good he has done it is for God's kingdom. Does he sell much? Then Praise God! Let God get the glory.
But just remember one thing, if Moses was replaceable by Joshua then Bishop Valverde can be replaced.
Everyone is replaceable! All the Glory to God!
No one in the apostolic asembly can replace Bishop Valverde. Sure, some brother so and so can fill his spot, but NO ONE, and I mean NO ONE can truly replace Bishop Valverde. There are none like him. Bishop Valverde is one of a kind. You know that and I know that you know and we all know that to be really, reall, REALLY TRUE.
We took a poll at FTC and Bishop Valverde has a 100% rating as Bishop and Pastor. Do you think he would rate so high in the polls if he weren't.
,Alert its official Daniel Sanchez is like Dr. Bruce Banner he transformed from a mild-mannered scientist to a seven foot, green-skinned, raging creature with limited intelligence and enormous strength.This creature was dubbed, "The Incredible Hulk."
Has anyone heard over the Dateline NBC investigation?
I am hearing that there is an media investigating and the General Offices does not want to comment.
It is just a matter of time before this election story hits the National News.
We took a poll at FTC and Sam has a 0% rating as a Christian and person. Do you think he would rate so low in the polls if he weren't. What a DUMB ..SS!!
Samuelin,
BINGO! You are right he is irreplaceable! Why would you ever want to replace some one like him? HELLO! What you would want to do is get RID of someone like Sammy! FYI There has been someone like him his name was Efrain! Efrain! Efrain! EFRAIN! EFRAIN! Remember? HA! HA! Some Bloodline here!
LA DIST.
BLASTPHEMERS
Sam - DUMB ..SS!!!!
trophyman
What did Efrain do so wrong?
To theinsider:
Who cares the man is gone! I just enjoy getting a reaction from Samuelin (the poor guy doesn't know how to put his panties on right) HA! HA! But FYI Sam Valverde speaks more of himself than the man upstairs when he preaches or teaches!
LA DIST.
Have you ever read Efrain's book? I heard that the reason they kicked him out was becuase he was making the other GB accountable.
To Theinsider:
I have read his book, and I can truly say there were some good things about him but there were also some not so good things about him either. His weakness was not having leadership skills basically the same as everyone on the GB these days. There is a big difference between dictatorship and leadership. Seems like the AA has been blessed with plenty of dictators. When you look at Sam Valverde it is like seing Efrain Valverde all over again. Sorry! (que en paz descance). Look at Sanchez with his cholo mentality you call that a leader? Espinoza, ever since I have known that guy all he knows how to do is shake his patita and grab his nose. Aguilar if it wasn't for him mastering the art of screaming I don't really know where he would be. Pacheco that man needs to deliver for what he scammed people for. Think about it, this guys have never had anything before they have a gold mine now, and that's without an education. LA You have a surprise coming! Unfortunately I signed a legal document at the meeting on Fri. and cannot go into detail but something great is in the works!
LA DIST.
ATENCION PASTORES – DECLARACION DE MISAEL J. ZARAGOZA. Marzo 29 del 2008.
En el párrafo 3, página 2, Misael Zaragoza escribe que la Comisión Electoral fue nombrada en Noviembre 23, 2006, un dÃa antes de la Elección, de acuerdo con el ArtÃculo 4, II de la Constitución de la Asamblea Apostólica de la Fe en Cristo Jesús (En este libro “Constitución de la ASAMBLEA APOSTOLICA”).
El propósito de Misael Zaragoza, al escribir – “de acuerdo con el ArtÃculo 4, II de la Constitución” – Es hacer creer al juez que en todo lo que hicieron en el proceso electoral, fueron muy apegados a la constitución (lo cual se ha estado probando a ustedes los Pastores que sà conocen la constitución, que eso no es verdad).
En el párrafo 5, página 2, Misael Zaragoza escribe: En la Elección de Noviembre del 2006, candidatos para cada posición en la Mesa Directiva General fueron seleccionados por el ministerio presente, escribiendo en boletas de manera secreta.
Ahora sabemos que ése fue el único tiempo en que a los Pastores se les permitió seleccionar precandidatos, siendo vÃctimas de engaño, ya que de acuerdo a las declaraciones de Sánchez y MartÃn del Campo, la verdadera selección la hizo la Comisión Calificadora, cuando solamente la mayorÃa de votos de ellos (Comisión Calificadora), fue lo que contó para seleccionar precandidatos.
Misael Zaragoza escribe que – “candidatos para cada posición fueron seleccionados por el ministerio presente” – Para hacer creer al juez que los ministros participaron en común acuerdo, en armonÃa, y en apego al ArtÃculo 4 de la constitución – Cuando en realidad, los Pastores ignoraban que sus votos estaban siendo ignorados por la Comisión Calificadora, especialmente, y premeditadamente, en cada primera ronda de votos.
Aquà cabe hacer una observación muy importante e interesante – Todos los Pastores que lean éste análisis, y que estuvieron presentes. Haciendo memoria de los acontecimientos, estarán de acuerdo en que Misael Zaragoza, cuando anunció la Presidencia, él dijo que por mayorÃa de votos, Sánchez habÃa sido electo Presidente. Y cuando anunció la Vicepresidencia, él dijo que por mayorÃa de votos, Valverde habÃa sido electo Vicepresidente.
O sea, los Pastores, ignorando lo que especialmente Sánchez y Valverde habÃan planeado, esto es, ignorar los votos de los Pastores – Inocentemente, y pensando que el Proceso Electoral se estaba haciendo con honestidad y apego a la constitución – Pues votaron en su mayorÃa por Sánchez y Valverde.
Y ¡Atención!, tratándose de ellos dos, fueron las únicas dos veces que los votos de los Pastores sà fueron tomados en cuenta - ¡Pero!, de Secretario en adelante, sólo contaron los votos de los cinco de la Comisión Calificadora, y el anticonstitucional CID, que usan como excusa para poner a quienes ellos quieren.
En el párrafo 6, página 2, Misael Zaragoza escribe – “Las boletas escritas identificando todos los ministros escogidos como candidatos para cada posición en la Mesa Directiva General fueron colectadas por la Comisión Electoral y fueron contadas. Los nombres de cada ministro electo para cada posición en la Mesa Directiva General fueron provistos a la Comisión Calificadora”.
Muy sutilmente, Misael Zaragoza usa expresiones como – “ministros escogidos como candidatos” – “Los nombres de cada ministro electo”… Para una vez más hacer creer al juez que los Pastores hicieron la parte que les correspondÃa en apego a la constitución – Y que al ser entregados los nombres a la Comisión Calificadora, ellos iban a hacer la parte que a ellos les correspondÃa en apego a la misma. Pero ahora sabemos que calificaron exclusivamente por los votos de ellos cinco, y dependiendo exclusivamente del CID.
El juez dice en la página 3, bajo Finding Number 5: Esta Corte encuentra que la Constitución requiere a la Comisión Calificadora que tome a su cargo dos pasos de proceso. Primero, la Comisión Calificadora determina cuales nominados recibieron el mayor número de votos (énfasis agregado). Una vez que este conjunto de nominados es identificado de entre todos los nominados, la Comisión Calificadora debe “considerar” la capacidad, idoneidad, y derecho sólo de aquellos nominados que están en el conjunto (identificado) – (adición añadida para mejor comprensión).
¡Atención! En la contradicción del juez – La Constitución está en silencio sobre cómo la Comisión Calificadora está para determinar cuáles nominados en el conjunto son para ser aprobados como candidatos.
¡Atención!, otra contradicción – En particular, no hay un requerimiento Constitucional de que la Comisión Calificadora apruebe solamente nominados con el mayor número de votos.
¿Qué no acababa de decir que la Corte encuentra que la Constitución requiere (énfasis agregado) que la Comisión Calificadora tome a su cargo dos pasos de proceso. Primero, que la Comisión Calificadora determine cuáles nominados recibieron el mayor número de votos? (énfasis agregado).
Una Pregunta para los Pastores - ¿SerÃa muy difÃcil, un gran problema, un misterio para la Comisión Calificadora, determinar quienes recibieron un mayor número de votos entre los que recibieron arriba de doscientos votos, arriba de trescientos votos – Contra los que recibieron de dos a cuatro votos aproximadamente, en la Primera Ronda de votos?
Otra Pregunta para los Pastores que sà conocen la constitución – En apego verdadero a la misma - ¿Qué no está muy claro y definido en el ArtÃculo 5, inciso II, que la Comisión Calificadora tomará en cuenta (énfasis agregado), de aquellos ministros que hayan obtenido un mayor número de votos (énfasis agregado), su capacidad, idoneidad y derecho, y aprobará (NO DICE QUE VOTARA – aclaración agregada) de dos a cinco de ellos como candidatos…?
Otras Preguntas para los Pastores - ¿Qué no dice el ArtÃculo 20, inciso I, que la Mesa Directiva General.. Velará porque los acuerdos, planes y proyectos aprobados por las Convenciones Generales… se cumplan? De acuerdo al Proceso del ArtÃculo 75 - ¿Qué no se lleva a veces hasta dos años para que finalmente quede una enmienda en algún ArtÃculo o inciso de la Constitución para que las cosas se hagan exactamente como quedó la enmienda, para evitar un anarquismo, o sea, un desorden por una ideologÃa que desecha toda autoridad?
En éste Caso, la Mesa Directiva General, y la Comisión Calificadora, han desechado la Autoridad de la constitución – Y la Autoridad de la elección por medio del voto Pastoral que la constitución le otorga a los Pastores en el ArtÃculo 4, inciso VI, en donde dice que la selección de los candidatos a los ocho puestos de la Mesa Directiva General, se hará por el voto secreto de todos los votantes (énfasis agregado) (No por los votos de únicamente los cinco de la Comisión Calificadora – adición con énfasis agregado). Y Misael Zaragoza los está respaldando en todo el Fraude que cometieron.
En el párrafo 7, página 3, Misael Zaragoza escribe – Después de que la Comisión Calificadora determinó cuáles candidatos fueron calificados para ser nominados para cada posición en la Mesa Directiva General, yo fui provisto con la lista de los nombres de los nominados. Una vez más, sutilmente, Misael Zaragoza quiere hacer aparecer ante el juez, como que todo se hizo de manera Honesta y Legal.
¡Atención Pastores!, otra contradicción del juez, en el inolvidable 10 de Marzo del 2008 – En la página 3, bajo Finding Number 6, dice – La Corte encuentra que no hay prohibición Constitucional en contra de la Comisión Calificadora usando el CID o cualquier otro documento o guÃa en la consideración de la capacidad, idoneidad y derecho de un nominado.
O sea que, si la Comisión Calificadora, decide usar una revista del Pato Donald, o de Mickey Mouse para calificar, lo pueden hacer, según eso, no hay prohibición constitucional en contra de ellos para que usen el escrito que se les antoje.
Pastores - ¿El ArtÃculo 75 de nuestra constitución, apoyará esta declaración del juez?
He aquà la contradicción del juez sobre el CID – En la página 4, abarcando los números 18 al 20 del margen izquierdo, él dijo: Está visto igualmente para esta Corte que el CID no fue incorporado en la Constitución por la vÃa de una enmienda (énfasis agregado).
¡Atención Pastores! Si el juez reconoce y declara que el CID no pasó por el proceso de enmienda - ¿Cómo es que declara antes, que no encuentra ninguna prohibición constitucional para que se use?
Ahora reflexionemos en lo siguiente - En el segundo set, sometido a la Corte por los Plaintiffs el 28 de Febrero, empezando desde la página 1 que dice: REPLY BRIEF IN SUPPORT OF SETTING ASIDE THE ELECTION DATED NOVEMBER 24, 2006 AND ORDERING A NEW ELECTION.
En la sección de Introducción, página 2, refiriéndose al CID, dice: El cual nunca fue adoptado de manera apropiada como un documento oficial para su uso en un Proceso Electoral.
En el párrafo 16, página 3, declararon: La Constitución no da autoridad a la Comisión Calificadora para basarse en el CID.
En la parte superior de la página 4, dice: En orden de que el CID fuera usado como un método para sentar normas por las cuales los candidatos sean juzgados, serÃa necesario enmendar la Constitución de acuerdo al CapÃtulo XXII, ArtÃculo 75 (énfasis agregado).
En los párrafos 8, 9, y 10 de la página 3, Misael Zaragoza, una vez más, sutilmente, se toma el tiempo para describir al juez, procesos que se llevaron a cabo – Pero lo que el juez no supo, es que Misael Zaragoza estaba explicando lo que pasó, pero después de la Segunda Ronda de votaciones. Misael Zaragoza no describe para nada, cómo se le hizo después de la Primera Ronda de votaciones, que fue en donde se cometió la principal parte del fraude electoral.
De hecho, en el párrafo 8, página 3, Misael Zaragoza miente al decir que los nominados para la primera posición de la Mesa Directiva General fueron expuestos a los ministros y se les pidió que presionaran en el aparato electrónico el número correspondiente para cada nominado – Ya que no hubieron nominados para una Segunda Ronda de votos para elegir Presidente. Después de la Primera votación, Sánchez fue declarado electo por mayorÃa de votos.
En el párrafo once, página 3, Misael Zaragoza miente de nuevo al decir que la computadora usada para contabilizar la votación final estaba a la vista (cuando en verdad estaba como el arca del pacto, o sea, detrás de cortinas, oculta a la vista hasta de él mismo, como dentro de un Tabernáculo).
Y luego dice que no parece que hubiera ninguna irregularidad con el proceso de conteo (o sea, que para Misael Zaragoza, no hay ninguna irregularidad con el hecho de que el conteo no se haya hecho como define la Constitución en el ArtÃculo 4, incisos VII, VIII, y XII).
Y como el juez no conoce la constitución como el Caso lo amerita y requiere – En el párrafo 12, página 4, Misael Zaragoza le escribe al juez, que en ningún tiempo durante la elección del 2006, él recibió una objeción, pregunta o preocupación acerca del proceso de elección o el uso de una computadora para el conteo de los votos finales.
Cuando el ArtÃculo 5, inciso V, define que las objeciones se hacen ante la Comisión Calificadora, y que ninguna objeción será presentada ni discutida ante el pleno de la asamblea.
Sin embargo, sà hubo un Pastor que intentó objetar ante la Comisión Calificadora, sobre la candidatura de Joel Montes – Llevando Pruebas de que estaba en violación de la Constitución por no tener la propiedad de la iglesia a nombre de la Asamblea, como define el ArtÃculo 30, y por lo tanto no podÃa ser calificado – Pero Samuel Valverde no le permitió entrar.
Y para cerrar ésta “interesante declaración”, finalmente, Misael Zaragoza, en una actitud deshonesta, utiliza una felicitación que le hizo de buena fe el Obispo Baldemar RodrÃguez, para escribirle al juez que de hecho, el Pastor Baldemar RodrÃguez Obispo en el pasado de la Asamblea Apostólica personalmente y públicamente lo felicitó por conducir una elección “bien corrida”.
Misael Zaragoza, Pastor en National City, Ca., si fue buen conductor detrás del púlpito, pero lamentablemente también ha sido muy bueno, apoyando un fraude electoral.
Una interesante pregunta es - ¿Por qué Valverde calificarÃa a Misael Zaragoza como Secretario, cuando estuvo al frente de la Comisión Calificadora en las elecciones del Distrito Sur de California, cuando ellos tuvieron su Convención Distrital en Octubre del 2007, aunque hubo objeciones en contra de Misael Zaragoza? ¿SerÃa gracias a la magia del CID? ó, ¿Por qué serÃa?
Qué pregunta tan difÃcil de contestar, ¿No? - ¡Dios tenga misericordia también, de Misael Zaragoza!
Quote AA.info
trophyman...
What! Are you involved with the people who are leaving?
If you are, why not invite others to leave.
I agree with you on the gentlemen that you mentioned. I really don’t believe that they would be able to make it in the business world. The corporate world would eat them alive.
So what will happen? Will they stay in power? Will the pressure get to them?
Timo Malo-verde is gay... He aint holy- his body and mind is corrupted, someone told me that he has been around the corner with his girlfriends...! Loser... cant complete a BA course got kicked out of school!
I think we should refrain from downgrading other people especially if we dont agree with them.
Why talk behind their back. I dont agree with what happened in 2006 but lets not attack someone with words.
One thing is to have constructive criticism but another is to totally attack them. Words are powerful and we either give life or death with our words.
Does anyone have a Bio on "Bishop" Ismael Martion Del Campo?
Was he a Dsitrict Bishop before?
Whats his educational background?
Whats his job history?
-----------------------------------
The man has a ragged church building. The church building is bringing down the area's property values.
The church is an utter disaster at all levels.
The building in deteriorating. The roof is about 40 years old. The building needs wood work from all the warped and termite damage. Not to mention the lack of landscape. If it wasn[t for the small sign in front of the church, you wouldn't know its a church.
Then there is a matter of the inside. The bathrooms are a wreck. The carpet is nasty. The drapes behind the pulpit are dirty as well as 30 years old. The place is just not maintained.
Then there is the matter of spiritual order. There is none. The MC barely whispers into the mic, while the keys player recites recent Marcos Witt concerts.
The ministers, music ministers, decons, ushers are unkept. They look as though they just rolled out of bed and went to church. There is no order. Children are allowed to play, the few youth that are there are also unkept and frequently talk during service.
In short, this is very unkept church. Its a reflection of the pastor, "Bishop" Ismael Martin Del Campo. His members are nice enough, but are not being lead, not being taught. This pastor is preparing his congregation for a lifetime of failure. He has not established any standards for his minsters and leaders.
How can this man, Martin Del Campo, be in the position he's in now as a pastor, let alone "Bishop" of the AA?
He's a man who, what I witnessed, have a crew come over to the church on a saturday, to detail his S Series Mercedes, than to pay a crew to do some work to his building.
How can this man lead the whole AA when he can't even lead his own church? If you can't keep up your own household, how can you lead the rest of us?
South Gate Apostolic Church is an Utter Disaster. Daniel Sanchez, Sam Valverde should be ashamed for this selection.
I'll post a picture of this church soon.
He's a "Bishop" on the National Board.
But his church membership is like 70 people. Thats a generous count too.
AMEN!!!
PREACH IT VAN.
I AGREE.
"One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;(For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)"
1 Timothy 3:4,5 (KJV)
OKAY SO WHATS GOING TO HAPPEN TO THE ASSEMBLEA DOES ANYONE KNOW? IS THERE GOING TO BE A DIVISION (I HOPE NOT) OR ARE THE MINISTERS JUST GOING TO STAY IN THE ASAMBLEA?
JUST TO LET YOU KNOW ALL CHURCHES HAVE THEIR OWN PROBLEMS, BUT THE IGLESIA APOSTOLICA HAS LEADERS THAT STILL HAVE "TEMOR DE DIOS" AND THATS WHY THE IGLESIA IS GROWING SO FAST IN THE USA. COMPARE THAT TO THE ASAMBLEA AND WHERE THAT 'TEMOR DE DIOS' HAS GONE!!!
The reason they are growing so fast is two-fold. First, the churches that leave the Assembly are joining the Iglesia,
Then, the Hermanos that come from Mexico now are congregating here.
I dont doubt that they win souls, but dont make them look like they are so superior.
TO SAM WHO WROTE
OH WOW! HOW SUPER OF HIM. GEEEPERS, LOOK AT ABEL TORRES TRAVELING THE TEXAS PLAINS IN A RV GOING TO SIT ON A CHURCH BENCH.
HE'S A MODERN SUPER HERO. GOING FROM CITY TO CITY TO SERVICE TO SERVICE. FROM LOVE OFFERING TO LOVE OFFERING.
YOU MAKE IT SEEM AS IF HE WAS GOING INTO THE PRISONS AND EVANGELIZING. LIKE IF HE WAS GOING TO JUAREZ, MEXICO TO WITNESS TO THE DRUG DEALERS. OR LIKE IF HE WAS SETTING UP AN PROGRAM FOR VICTIMS OF HUMAN TRAFFICKING.
OH BUT NO, HE'S SITE SEEING IN HIS RV, GOING TO A CHURCH SERVICE, COLLECT AN OFFERING SINCE HE'S NOT GETTING HIS BISHOP PAYCHECK ANYMORE.
Pastor Torres, has gone to preach in the prisons and in various parts of Mexico. And many times, his love offering was but a simple few dollars.
If you only knew who Pastor Torres is and what he stands for you would respect him even more!
I'M NOT MAKING THEM LOOK LIKE NOTHING THE ASAMBLES IS BARELY STARTING TO WORK THE CELLULAS AND THE IGLESIA HAS BEEN WORKING WITH SOULS LIKE THIS FOR A WHILE, BESIDES THE IGLESIA IS NOT ASKING FOR THE ASAMBLEA TO JOIN THE CHURCH, IT WOULD PROBABLY BE BETTER IF THEY DIDNT AND GO THEIR OWN WAY.
Apostolic Blood
"the Iglesia is not asking the Asamblea to join them"
Oh no? Did you see their letter on our blog on March 20th?
BE REALISTIC THAT WAS SOMEONE THAT IS NOT EVEN ON THE MESA DIRECTIVA OF THE IGLESIA. I WAS ACTUALLY AT THE CONVENTION IN DALLAS AND NO ONE MENTIONED ANYTHING ABOUT THE ASAMBLEA OR INVITING ANYONE FROM THE ASAMBLEA TO JOIN. THEY HAVE ALWAYS REFERRED TO THE ASAMBLEA AS NUESTRA HERMANA IGLESIA. NEVER HAVE THEY PROHIBITED COMMUNICATION WITH THE ASAMBLEA LIKE THE ASAMBLEA HAS TO THE IGLESIA.
Hmm, so you know the identities of everyone on this "Asamblea" blog? Maybe you should get on the "Iglesia" blog and show them your support. Looks to me like you're just zigzagging.
I know one thing. Apostolic Blood is from Texas and she is a sister. My trace is almost done...I will reveal you Apostolic Blood!
Fabian, I understand you Texans seem to think you can control the whole wide world just because you have that white guy in the white house. It won't work! There are no qualified Texans to run a well organized apostolic church what was founded in California.
You Texans need to mind your place and mind it good. Go start your Texacana church. I'm sure you have pleanty of rancho land to do that seeing how Texas is the home of a city call Wacko. What is where those Branch Dividians was at when and before Bill Clinton had to send the Army to clean you Texans up and put you in place. Checkmate.
Why don't all you Texans like stay in Taxes and do that thing you do best, which is provide cow meat to the country and bad music too. The only music you Taxens have is country and western and they both bite the big Texas fly.
No one in ever the history what is the apostolic assembly church can or has been from Texas where a Texan ran the church. Not that I'm biased but you can't expect some former ranch hand to have the talent and bilities that Bishop Sam Valverde has and Bishop Sanchez tooo. Seems to me that all the apostolic general board is from Califas.
Deal with it you Taxens!
Bishop Valverde is the best bishop ever. And whats a awesome pastor too.
Stay off the booze Sam.
sammy, sammy, sammy...
you are a hater because your aa has been led by...
llorente-born in mexico
nava- born in mexico
cantu- born in texas
valverde- born in mexico
salazar- born in california
rodriguez- born in texas
vizcarra- born in mexico
sanchez- born in california
sum it up if you are not too drunk in yourself... the mexicans have given you and the aa four leaders, the texans have given two and california the same
stop hating you ________!
oh almost forgot
sanchez- california
valverde- california
pacheco- california
maffey- mexico
espinoza- california
aguilar- california
del campo- mexico
prado- mexico
our south of the border neighbors are still producing your aa leaders
Sam,
Why don't you also tell the bloggers how you follow Timo Valverde around in church. Why don't you tell them that his girfriend hates you because YOU pay so much attention to him. The texans might provide cow meat to the country and bad music too, but you and california sure have been producing the "Flor Azules."
One last thing, tell them why your highness melverde also put you on prueba. Dumb ..ss!!
to FAVIAN
So you like to "Scare" people by "revealing their identity" dont you? thats so gay I mean you tried only tried doing it to me but like i told you i dont give a sack of potatoes if people know who I am so please just dedicate to discuss the topics not to see if you can figure out who is who here ok? thank you come back and see us =)
What do you expect when you have a General Board that is made up of un educated paisas and ex cholos and pachucos ?
They keep appointing their own kind.
I got nothing against paisas they are good people. But you dont just slap a suit on someone and expect them to have leadership and management skills.
And as for the vatos locos from east los who are now pastors. It appears that the macho im the boss and el mas fregon mentality doesnt die so easily.
Sad Sad Sad
With all those foreclosures, bank owned properties, bankruptcy properties in the market being given away by the banks makes Edward Pacheco and his Ex-Felon Minister Garduno plan to invest hermano's money into Fixer Uppers look STUPID.
from reliable sources...
the aa is finally going to houston to remove pastor willie mendoza after all. bishop joe mendoza (his son and daughter-in-law) are going to houston to be there for support. all this is transpiring on friday april 4.
let's keep the mendoza family and congregation in our prayers.
Finally! Its time for the new generation of apostolic ministers to move the apostolic church to a higher level from glory to glory. Its time for all those old timers like Willie "I'm 80 years old and married a 20 year old" Medoza to move to the retirement home.
There's a house cleaning coming to the apostolic church!
Its high time for the new generation of apostolic leaders to move up and step up and lead us from the spiritual ghetto.
Sam they should start with getting rid of you and themselves or it will never be cleaned.
I wonder of Pacheco lost any money in this housing market downturn? If I'm not mistaken, a blogger posted some information about properties that he owned. I wonder if he'll need to dip in the ofrenda to pay for the mortgages.
I don't see how these pastors just sit back and take this treatment from the AA. I guess when your livleyhood and identity is wrapped up in this organization one would have no choice.
Sam,
Maybe your boy Timo canget a church, and you can become his monkey. This way your services can become offical! Dumb ..ss!!!
Sam, there was some interesting information this morning on the Bureau Labor Statistics that California has been ranked out of 10 worst states with no jobs. Now I know why you have so much time in your hands, you don't have a job!! Well, guess what Texas does because I see it everyday people from all over the country especially California are moving over here looking for a job! Well, I've got to run my office is waiting with tons of work. Have a great day!
Hey Sam,
Ignoring my comments doesn't take away the fact that I'm still watching you at church. I was going to go elsewhere, but just knowing who you are in church, and watching you constantly looking over your shoulder is enough to make me stay.
If people only knew what I know about you, they wouldn't even give you the time of day, even on the internet. You are a prime example of a hypocrite. No wonder the Bible calss people like you, "...hypocrites! You clean the outside of the cup and dish, but inside they are full of greed and self-indulgence (the GB). Blind Pharisee (Sam)! First clean the inside of the cup and dish, and then the outside also will be clean. Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees (GB), you hypocrites! You are like whitewashed tombs, which look beautiful on the outside but on the inside are full of dead men's bones and everything unclean. In the same way, on the outside you appear to people as righteous but on the inside you are full of hypocrisy and wickedness." Matthew 23:25-28 (NIV).
Anyone notice the name of The President of The Assembly on The Wikipedia site ?
That must be who really is moving the puppet strings.
The current General Board for the 2006-2010 term is composed of the following Bishops:
Bishop President- Bishop Samuel Valverde
Vice-President- Bishop Samuel Valverde
General Secretary- Bishop Samuel Valverde
General Treasurer- Bishop Samuel Valverde
Secretary of Foreign Missions- Bishop Arthur Espinoza
Secretary of National Missions- Bishop Abel Aguilar
Secretary of Christian Education- Bishop Ismael Martin del Campo
Secretary of Social Assistance- Bishop Victor Prado
CBG, you don't even go to FTC. If you did, with all the junk you talk you would have had approached me. I was curious but I already figuered you out to be a little internet worm who maybe knows a couple of peeps at FTC but really, you are still a little worm with only no apples to go into and rotten them. Wash your own dishes before you tell me about my dishes cause the only thing I got is all the truth I have been dishing out on this website to all you workers of inquinity slandering the men of God. CBG, you is not no more a member of FTC than you is a really inportant member of society unless you are working at a carwash in Bloomington.
As for you Texans who say Texas is more better than California, yes. You do have more jobs. More low wage jobs doing all that farm work on those ranches making cows and meat for California. Someone has to work in the fields, who better to do a low skill, low wage job than Texans. See, I saw the Annual Report from the General Offices, and California churches pay more in thithes. That means Californians from California make more money.
I think its "Chow Time" on the ranch. I hear that Texas Cowbell ringing. lol
Sam, HA HA HA HA, LOL LOL LOL LOL, What an idiot. Hello!! If I approach you at church and youfind out who I am then I can't get your generic christians feathers all rilled up! I WILL CONTINUE TO HAUNT YOU AS LONG AS YOU CONTINUE TO MANIFEST YOUR HIPOCRITICAL SELF! As far as "CBG, you is not no more a member of FTC than you is a really inportant member of society." I IS! Learn to write English. I IS NOT A MEMBER because I haven't been baptized. Which is the only difference between me and you. Because judging by your words you're as much of a christian as I am. The other difference is that I'm NOT A DUMB ..SS like you, Dumb ..ss!
ps. I'll be watching you at the next youth activity coming up!
If you guys really know who SAM is just tell us.
If I tell you folks who Sam is, he won't come back on the blogs to make a fool of himself! I'm telling you this boy is such an idiot his reputation at church preceeds him. You should hear what is being said about Sammys orientation outside church!
CBG, orientation? You don't even know what you are talking about. I know what you are trying to say but you know I am not that way. Besides, you not even go to FTC and I know you are lying because once you said you saw me talking to Tim and I wasn't even there. You drop a couple of names of people from FTC, but those are just names you got from the church website. Yuo think you're all the smarter than all of us but your really not cleaver. For all I know your some retard from Ontario or from UC who's just jelous because I dress with the latest fashion. Do me a big favor and go back to frying those french fries because I like my Big Mac with lots of fries and keptchup and a McMuffin for breakfast. '
Enrique,
Maybe they're just posting the results of the next election??
CBG, you are one of those retards from Ontario. You guys have been trying to out do us for ever. Your youth are clueless and your church is in need of great changes, especially from the music department with all those oldies you have playing the cantos from the 80's and 70's and like no one even cares except for those crooked and false ministers you have.
You got to know, you need to learn to get a spiritual education because you are not speaking like you know anything from an edcuation man and you are not going to go to next convention because half your ontario congreagtion membership would get cauht by the ICE immigration and get deported.
No Jimenez will ever be president of the apostolic church.
Sam,
Like, I don't care what you say about ontario - I don't even know who they are, so keep talking dumb ..ss! And where in the world did you learn english? Quote "you need to learn to get a spiritual education because you are not speaking like you know anything from an edcuation man..." what is an "edcuation man"? Is that code name for the "flor Azules"? My God Sam you sound like a mocho pocho. Correction, like a macho menos (flor azules).
I guess you also went to La Puente college just like your peeps here at FTC uh! By the way Sam, notice that nobody is coming to your rescue - you wanna know why? Because nobody wants to associate with a dumb ..ss like yourself. JUST LIKE AT CHURCH - What a payaso!
TO SAM AND CBG:
"Hiding hatred makes you a liar; slandering others makes you a fool."
Proverbs 10:18 (NLT)
"A fool is quick-tempered,but a wise person stays calm when insulted."
Proverbs 12:16(NLT)
"The wise don’t make a show of their knowledge,but fools broadcast their foolishness."
Proverbs 12:23 (NLT)
"Stay away from fools,for you won’t find knowledge on their lips."
Proverbs 14:7 (NLT)
Please take this advice.
With love,
jajemo
Jajemo
Thank you for the Scriptures, I'll consider them even though I'm not a christian. However, reading Sams responses, from a guy who is supposed to be a christian, leaves very little desire to become one.
Sam's lack of christian character and the verbal attacks he spews agains other christians is a reflection of the church he attends. Either his pastor doesn't teach the truth of Scripture, or Sam is a hearer only but not a doer. What a poor, sorry example of an apostolic!
At least I speak about the people I see at church, and the accounts I witness at FTC. Sam however, even slanders people he doesn't even know. I wonder what is worse, a sinner speaking foolishness, or a so called christian spewing garbge?
As with everything, you Apostolics ruined the spirit and purpose of this blog site.
There is a clear pattern in the assembly, and that is, everything you touch either self-destructs or loses it's absolute purpose. I would've never thought that this curse would transfer over into something so trivial as a blog site.
Very sad indeed.
I am asking; since when has the general board give permission to pastor Sam Mascareno and now pastor Misael Zaragoza to tell their congregations that if they don't have convictions about the wedding ring they can wear it.and other things too. Are these still Apostolic assembly churches? Are they still Apostolic pastors?
So Whats next?
It will be ok to scam the hermanos out of their hard earned money by car buying scams and real estate scams.
Oh yeah thats been done already!
Lets see it will be ok only if your convictions let you to use your position to pressure the hermanos to join in the Cyberwize which you are a top director.
oh yeah thats been done 2.
Only if your convictions allow you fix the elections so your buddies are on the band wagon and then go after the men that voiced an opinion against you, and have them removed.
wow done that 2!
And this is a biggie, and only if your convictions really allow you. use pictures of the Missionaries to raise large amounts of money to be used for the mission field, only to keep the vast amount for the general headquarters expense.
Nah they wouldn't shoop that low>
Would they?
I see that they are moving Puerto Rico, Canada and Hawaii from International Missions to National Missions Under Abel Aguilar.
Guess abel can now go to hawaii on the company credit card, and take the whole COMMITTEE MEMBERS which include his two sons.
COME AGAIN AND FABIAN:
WHAT EVER IF NO OPINIONS WERE WANTED FROM THE PUBLIC ON THIS BLOG THEN IT SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN PUT ON THE INTERNET, THATS WHY THE BLOG SPOT FOR ABEL TORRES WAS REMOVED. AND WHAT EVER THE IGLESIA DOES NOT HAVE A SITE LIKE THIS ONE WHERE YOU CAN PUT EVERYONE AND THEIR GRANDMA DOWN. LIKE IT OR NOT THEY COULD TEACH OUR HONORABLE ASAMBLEA SOME MANNERS.
HOPE FULLY YOU GUYS CAN GUESS WHO I AM YES LIKE I SAID BEFORE I WAS FROM TEXAS, NOW I RESIDE IN CALIFORNIA. GOOD LUCK BOYS!!
Characteristics of Spiritual Abuse
Some writers conceptualize a set of discernible characteristics of spiritual abuse.
Authority and Power - abusive groups misuse and distort the concept of spiritual authority. Abuse arises when leaders of a group arrogate to themselves power and authority that lacks the dynamics of open accountability and the capacity to question or challenge decisions made by leaders. The shift entails moving from general respect for an office bearer to one where members loyally submit without any right to dissent.
Manipulation and Control - abusive groups are characterized by social dynamics where fear, guilt, and threats are routinely used to produce unquestioning obedience, group conformity, and stringent tests of loyalty to the leaders are demonstrated before the group. Biblical concepts of the leader-disciple relationship tend to develop into a hierarchy where the leader's decisions control and usurp the disciple's right or capacity to make choices on spiritual matters or even in daily routines of what form of employment, form of diet and clothing are permitted.
Elitism and Persecution - abusive groups depict themselves as unique and have a strong organizational tendency to be separate from other bodies and institutions. The social dynamism of the group involves being independent or separate, with diminishing possibilities for internal correction and reflection. Outside criticism and evaluation is dismissed as the disruptive efforts of evil people seeking to hinder or thwart.
Life-style and Experience - abusive groups foster rigidity in behavior and in belief that requires unswerving conformity to the group's ideals and social mores.
Dissent and Discipline - abusive groups tend to suppress any kind of internal challenges and dissent concerning decisions made by leaders. Acts of discipline may involve emotional and physical humiliation, physical violence or deprivation, acute and intense acts of punishment for dissent and disobedience.
SOUND FAMILIAR ???????????????????
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