COMMENTS HAVE BEEN DISABLED IN THIS SECTION. FEEL FREE TO COMMENT IN THE LATEST BLOG. Apostolic VoiceThe election irregularities of the 2006 General Convention impact the members of its organization in different ways. After seeing the way this has been used for a one sided discussion, it is imperative that an unbiased view be allowed to moderate its discussion.
For those that are aware of the legal implications and jockeying, please feel free to add your opinion here. As previous stated, this site will be moderated for its content.
1,047 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 1001 – 1047 of 1047and pastors dear bro.
what I here Carranco is in as Bishop for the South Texas District ( re-elected or appointed )it does not matter, as long you are a good friend of Valverde and Pacheco.
what does any of this mean to all of you?
thanks for the info on south texas the west texas convention was not a very joyful one either. Imagine who were the board members that attended?
that they are applying the CID on every convention (general and district) and not the most qualified man for the job.
isn't the creator of the CID from mexico, can he hold a GB position?
like they say, as long you are a friend of valverde and pacheco.
OPEN LETTER TO: President Sanchez & the honorable mesa directiva
ALSO TO: Bishops, Solomon, Rodriguez, Jauhall, Arellano, Galviz, Aguirre, Torres, Fortino, Tafoya,et.al
AS A LAY MEMBER OF THIS ORGANIZATION I WOULD APPEAL TO YOU TO RETURN TO THE NEGOTIATING TABLE AND WORK THROUGH THIS MATTER FOR THE SAKE OF THE PEOPLE.
THE DAMAGE HAS ALREADY BEEN DONE, BUT NO WHERE NEAR WHERE THIS WILL ALL END UP.
THERE WILL BE GREAT DIVISION. THERE WILL BE RUINED REPUTATIONS AND LIVES.
MANY OF YOU HAVE GIVEN YOUR LIFE, YOUR FAMILY, AND YOUR REPUTATION TO THE WORK OF THE LORD.
THERE WILL BE LOSS OF LIFETIME FRIENDS, BECAUSE WHO EVER LOSES IN THIS BATTLE WILL BE SHUNNED BY THE ORGANIZATION.
IF YOU RETURN TO THE TABLE AND FIND A MIDDLE GROUND PERHAPS THERE CAN BE A CORRECTION. PERHAPS THIS IS JUST A MISUNDERSTANDING.
CALL OFF YOUR ATTORNEYS AND COME BACK TO SPEAK ABOUT THIS MATTER OPENLY AS BRETHREN WHO WILL SOME DAY SING NEXT TO THE HEAVENLY HOST BEFORE THE THRONE OF GOD.
"Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool"
Isaiah 1:8
"Hatred stirreth up strifes: but love covereth all sins" Proverbs 10:12
Alert Alert!!!
Can you ask your pastor if he received a bunch of documents from Texas. Some pastors are telling me they got one.
Open Letter to President Sanchez:
Title:
"APOSTOLIC ASSEMBLY 911"
Dear Brother Sanchez,
You are in the midst of the greatest crisis in the history of the Apostolic Assembly. We can say this is our "911"
You know the sweat and tears that many have given to build this church. Think of your friends: Robert Ramirez, Tom Ramirez. Think about the legacy left by many bishops you worked with like Elias Escamilla, Franscisco Mesa. Think about some of the men that men of the young people don't even know like brother Francisco Llorente, Hermano Antonio Nava. Do you remember some of the Mexican officials which we have long ago separated ourselves from?
I am not here to judge, there may be a reason we no longer associate with the Mexican Iglesia Apostolica, God will judge.
You have the opportunity to secure your God given destiny and legacy.
It wasn't until 911 occurred that George W. Bush defined his purpose, his destiny.
You in a sense are at the 911 of the Apostlic Assembly.
A lot of pastor's, ministers, sisters and plain lay people wonder what you will do.
Will you stand up and take charge?
You more than anyone can say enough is enough.
We had the opportunity to see a glimpse of your heart in your response to a letter by Bishop Art Tafoya dated April 18, 2007.
In your email response to Bishop Tafoya we saw that you are a man of reason.
In your email you stated (Quote)
-------------------------
Bishop Tafoya,
¡PdC!
Thank you for your heads-up. This is the first real letter with any substance to consult the Constitution. I will pass your recommendations under advisement and give you an official response in the next week or so.
God Bless
dgsánchez
--------------------------
I know a lot of things have been said about you in this and other forums, but I say that you are a man of integrity.
I know that you never sought the position of President. Your desire has been to protect and honor the position of Bishop President.
I know that if it was up to you, you would happily leave the position of President. Yes, I know you are no "push-over", but you are to some degree a man of humility.
Many of the members of this organization wait and watch as you respond to the Apostolic Assemblies "911".
How will you respond?
Many feel that you are giving in to other board members that are influencing you not to give in and do an investigation.
I don't know who you voted for General Secretary and it doesn't matter at this point.
Anyone would think that if you really wanted to replace brother Solomon as Gen. Secretary, a more logical sense would have been to put in your family member, brother Artie Espinosa.
We don't exactly know who is influencing the most in your board meetings, but what we members do know is that you are at the helm of the Apostolic "911".
You seemed open to discuss this matter further as brethren should in your email mentioned above.
I appeal to you not to allow anyone on the board to influence you beyond what you know in your heart is right.
You have the responsibility to stand up and say "Enough is enough".
Even if you decide not to stop this "911" crisis, perhaps you can show the members of this church that their will be reforms, real reforms in the way voting is conducted so that this never happens again.
Your legacy is about to be written on earth as well as in heaven.
Signed,
A lay person who is neutral to both sides
Are you really A LAY MEMBER OF THIS ORGANIZATION ?
Humbly so!
Why do you ask?
I was asking the 4:50 post
You equal Sanchez with George Bush, but not so, he is equal to Saddam Hussein.
pastor's in Texas have received documents concerning the lawauit.
I understand your frustration with Sanchez. But I don't think we should lower ourselves to say he is equal to Saddam.
That's the danger we have in our AA .The good hearts of pastors and members to be tamper by this GB.
we compare Sanchez to Saddam because Saddam claimed to have gotten 99% of the vote. seems Saddam and Sanchez employ the same voting system.
Post 6:09 PM
I never equated brother Sanchez to George Bush.
I just drew parallel comparisons between two different critical situations and two different individuals.
Both men at a crossroads.
Just like I can draw comparison between Albert Einstien and you, sir.
WE NEED A NEW ELECTION!!!! WE NEED A NEW BOARD !!!!! THE BEST TIME IS AT THE DALLAS CONVENTION !!!!!
post 6:25 PM
Realize that is not going to happen.
Whether you or I like it or not there will not be a new board.
There are only two ways this will get resolved.
1-The current board humbles themselves and prays. Then they will hear from heaven and allow an investigation or new elections.
2-The parties who are taking a stand for TRUTH, who are laying their reputation, their literal legacy on the line...Force another election!
to 5:35 p.m.
Sanchez
a man of integrity.?
a man of humility.?
man of reason?
2-The parties who are taking a stand for TRUTH, who are laying their reputation, their literal legacy on the line...Force another election!
To this point this is the most realistic scenario.
whatever it takes... it must happen this GB is going nowwhere. They can even deliver new expositors to my pastor, but its actually better I did not like the comic book they know have.
The fact it this GB is stacked against those who oppose it.
Like it or not they have the upper hand.
In the end, You and I may be stuck with them.
...and the merry-go-round goes round and round!
It's all child's play.
They are playing with the things of God.
They may never get their judgement here. It will probably happen in the after life!
TRUTHFULLY!
LET ME GIVE YOU A MESSAGE ORIGINALLY GIVEN BY BISHOP BALDEMAR RODRIGUEZ
"RUN CHURCH...RUN!!!"
Bishop may have been prophecying about this very thing we are in.
So I tell you to run away and out from this AA organization, NOW!!
RUN CHURCH, RUN!!!
are only chance is the dallas convention, we must let our voice be heard as members. It is our assembly also and the times have change, just the fact that we can communicate without any worries.I care for our assembly.
To me is detrimental not to have a pastor in this blog giving us his opinion on this matter. Of course I don't care about your name only your opinion.
8:00 PM
To me it is not detrimental to have pastor give their opinion on this blog.
I think we should hear from everyone. Why be like the GB where things are filtered.
Lets hear from everyone equally, whether you are male, female, Bishop President, pastor or just a member of the organization without a name or position.
I agree but it will be nice to hear from them. Remember they are the ones with power of the vote, not us.
Abuse of Authority in the Church
A Biblical Perspective of Leadership
by Pastor.......
A sad and unfortunate fact in many Apostolic churches today is that Bishops,elders ,pastors, ministers exert or attempt to exert a heavy-handed, authoritarian type of control over their membership. While many of these leaders are well meaning, frequently authoritarianism is rooted in a hunger for power and control. These leaders rationalize and defend such behavior under the guise of love and shepherding. The Bible indeed gives a certain level of spiritual authority to church leadership, but all too often such authority is abused and misused, going well beyond what the scriptures allow.
As a result, many sincere and well-intentioned believers are led astray into extra and unbiblical teachings. The ultimate outcome is a distorted view of Christ and the gospel, which causes many to ultimately walk away from God altogether. For those that manage to function within an authoritarian church, commonly feelings of guilt, condemnation, and worthlessness hang like a dark cloud over their Christian walk. Obviously, this is not what God intended for his children. Jesus said, “For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.” (Matt. 11:31)
In this article, we will examine what the Bible says about authority and the role that spiritual leaders are to play in the lives of believers.
Clearly, God calls many of His children to offices for the purposes of leading and shepherding the flock. Bishops (pastors), teachers, administrators, etc. are all biblically ordained roles (cf. Eph. 4:11, 1 Tim 3:1), but just how much authority are these offices given?
Paul, the most prolific New Testament writer and one of the greatest apostles, never once claimed control over the personal lives of his followers. He could have easily elevated himself to a self-important and tyrannical position over the church as many pastors do today. Yet he knew that he was to be a servant-leader, not a dictator. In II Corinthians 1:24, Paul wrote,
“Not that we have dominion over your faith, but are fellow workers for your joy...”
Of all people, Paul could have claimed dominion over another’s faith but instead considered himself a “member of the team,” charged with helping people mature in their faith. Paul led by example not by militant rule.
In the same letter to the Corinthians, Paul addressed those that did wish to control the church by militant rule. In II Corinthians 11:19-20 Paul says,
“For you put up with fools gladly, since you yourselves are wise! For you put up with it if one brings you into bondage, if one devours you, if one takes from you, if one exalts himself, if one strikes you on the face.”
It seems that in Corinth there were those in the church that wished to bring the church into bondage by exalting themselves above others. In other words, these self-important leaders were enslaving the congregation with their authority, and the Corinthians foolishly tolerated it.
Peter also understood what God’s expectations were for leaders. He wrote in 1 Peter 5:1-3,
“The elders who are among you I exhort...Shepherd the flock of God which is among you, serving as overseers, not by compulsion...nor as being lords over those entrusted to you, but being examples to the flock.”
Peter could not have been clearer. He explicitly states to lead by example, not as a lord. He says to serve as an overseer and not to force people into submission. In other words, lead, but “not by compulsion.”
John spoke of dictators in the church as well. John wrote about Diotrephes who loved to control members of the church. Like many pastors today, Diotrephes spoke poorly of other churches and other Christians and forbade members from fellowshipping with them. III John 1:9-10 says,
“I wrote to the church, but Diotrephes, who loves to have the preeminence among them, does not receive us. Therefore, if I come, I will call to mind his deeds, which he does, prating against us with malicious words. And not content with that, he himself does not receive the brethren, and forbids those who wish to, putting them out of the church.”
Jesus taught plainly in regard to the proper role of leadership, speaking against those that “lord” over others. He even taught that He did not come to be served, but to serve others. In Mark 10:42-45, Jesus said,
“You know that those who are considered rulers over the Gentiles lord it over them, and their great ones exercise authority over them. Yet it shall not be so among you...For even the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve...”
He stated that we as Christians are not to lord over others, abusing our authority as the Gentile leaders did. Jesus says, “…it shall not be so among you.”
A scripture commonly used to justify abusive control and authoritarianism by the leaders of some churches is Hebrews 13:17 that instructs believers to, “Obey those who rule over you…” These leaders think that this means they have blanket authority over the flock entrusted to them and that they can proceed to take control over the personal lives and personal faith of believers. The word obey in this passage literally means “to be persuaded by”1 in the original text. Nothing in this verse gives church leadership unrestrained control over the lives of others. Instead it teaches believers to consider the example set by truly loving, God-fearing, servant-leaders that lead us to Christ.
In short, those that wish to act as dictators are not fulfilling a calling of God but are instead elevating themselves into a position to serve their own self-interests and ambitions. They step outside of biblical teachings for the purpose of fulfilling their desires to control the lives of others. Some of the greatest leaders in the Bible – Paul, Peter, John and even Jesus Himself – explicitly taught against those that wish to “lord” over believers. Ironically, those that claim “authority” themselves reject genuine authority – that of the scriptures and of the Lord Jesus Christ.
To all the ones who openly murmur against the current GB and decide to gossip about them openly and even add and exaggerate against them, I have just one thought for you. . .
According to Dan 4:25,34-37, God is in control of who has dominion, and He alone puts and removes and who can ask him why do you do what you do?
I understand your frustrations but you have to understand that all was permitted by God's sovereign will. Matt 10:29 says that not even a sparrow falls to the ground without God permitting. It is not your job to demand a re election, or to “sue for justice,” God puts and removes and no one knows or has at least asked if God wanted these men in office to be the ones in office!
These are not things to be played with, on either side of the fence. If there was wrong doing and the will of God was not done, in time, in God’s time, God will correct it. If this is really the body of Christ, don’t you think God’s will will ultimately prevail? Do you think God needs your intervention and your help in order to execute his will? Can’t he turn someone into a beast like creature as in Dan 4 to show his power, dominion and sovereign authority?
What if God allowed this to happen because THIS WAS in His perfect will? Do you realize that this would constitute you enemies of God’s will? Have you not learned the lessons of the Old Testament regarding the people that murmured against their GB and questioned their ecclesiastical authority? Just look at Numbers chapters 12, 16 and 17. God does not tolerate rebellion. You are putting yourselves at great risk by not knowing the will of God, and jumping on the bandwagon. PLEASE STOP READING THIS COMMENT AND READ THE CHAPTERS IN NUMBERS THAT I QUOTED. Your health, your well being, even your lives may depend on it. Let God be God. Be careful. The damage you might cause to the GB will soon pass, but whether you like it or not, the men currently in position represent the GB of GOD’S CHURCH! READ NUMBERS!!! Many of you need to repent of murmuring, not against DS or SV or EP, but against AAP, AAVP, etc., the men currently in authority over the body of Christ! This is not an attempt to silence your opinions. This is a reminder to voice them with the fear of God at the forefront of your minds. The bitterness and resentment expressed on this site goes far beyond the elections and they are rooted in the depths of your soul. You have specific petitions in your life you want answered. God can set you free and heal your body and soul, but you need to ask God to grant you true repentance. You might be at the verge of a breakthrough or on the verge of becoming reprobate.
Either way, you are running out of time, and you defile and contaminate yourselves with every word that comes out of you that is not of God (Mat 15:18 But what comes out of the mouth proceeds from the heart, and this defiles a person.
Mat 15:19 For out of the heart come EVIL THOUGHTS, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false witness, SLANDER.
Mat 15:20 These are what defile a person. But to eat with unwashed hands does not defile anyone.").
Some of you wonder why you can’t feel the Holy Spirit and others don’t even know if you have it or not. Time’s almost up! Christ is coming and you need to get ready!! Please! Consider yourselves admonished and warned.
Yes Bishops that think that they are Lords.....Run districts for 8 years and never do anything but push their weight around.
Like the great retired Bishop from the Central district. when he retired they said what a great job he did. I asked myself "Like
what"? Just sat on his throne and wrote his books...never cared what felt like and never cared that we were hurting...all he cared about was himself and how he looked to the general offices.
you are good at defending the GB but also good at condeming the rest of us. When one knows what is the truth and speaks on those grounds and respect, we can still feel the Holy Spirit of God. It is obvious that you do not know the whole truth.
Chuy are you a pastor?
I can only imagine seeing Bishop Benjamin Cantu in our general convention in Texas giving a piece of his mind to this GB.
How we need men like him in our days.
TO: CHUY 10:04 PM
You make the most preposterous claim to a Bible study in the name of Almighty God.
Where did you go to bible school?
To say that we should accept this fraud as God's divine will reminds me of another church organization which used the same thought process to perpetrate leadership abuse on innocent children.
The Catholic Church has hidden their leader’s wrongs for many years.
They have swept abuse of innocent children in the name of "We will deal with this in house".
Unfortunately, when things are not dealt with in openness and truthfulness how can you trust your leaders?
Those whose actions are in question should recuse themselves from any committee involving these elections and allow a proper public pastoral investigation to proceed.
Were the result of this election God’s divine will?
You sound Calvanistic bro!
SATAN caused both the abuse by the priests and also any fraud by the Assembly leaders.
I guess if brother Sanchez and brother Valverde go to the dance club and drink all night...that is God’s will also!
WOW!
That sounds so much like the theology of a cult religion who calls themselves Christians
It took a good lawsuit against the Catholic church to stop abuse by the leadership and it will probably have to take a good lawsuit against the Assembly to stop the authoritarian abuse by it’s leadership!
Amen to that. I hope you are a pastor with guts to stand a tell them the truth on their faces.
AMEN 10:42 PM!!!!
God used the lawsuits filed against the Catholic church and God will also use the lawsuit against the Assembly to bring out the Truth.
How can someone come in here and say don't read this? Yet they come in here and themselves read these postings?
Wierd.
Sounds like a authoritarian pastor!
The blog-master said
Quote:
"This speaks clearly of the type of pastoral leadership we have in the Assembly. For not 1 on of the 600+ spoke out against the CID in the years prior to the election including all the Bishops!
I know some Pastor's look for yes men in their churches, those that will follow blindly, but these Pastor's should be held accountable as well for allowing this to happen. Pastor's need not be yes men and follow blindly in order that they can move to the next level".
Pastors of this AA if after Gaylord this GB stays in power you are the ones to blame.
There is going to be a lawsuit after all?
Nice sermon Valvderde. Using spiritual threats is a form of witchcraft. Gods will on earth is done by his creatures with the ability to reason.
You speak with such spiritual authority. Yet our prophet is too much of a coward to sign his name.
That equals a false prophet.
Go back to La Puente Bible school.
According to this false prophet 99.99 % of AA are going to hell.
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APOSTOLIC VOICE
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